On a 4S1P lipo, what does the 1P mean??

[pgiroma]

I have noticed some LIPOs listed as 4S1P with a voltage rating of 14.8v , the same as a 4S battery. I haven't a clue what 4S1P stands for. Can anyone explain this to me?

[pgiroma]

My reason for asking is that some TURNIGY batteries are listed as 4S1P, but others are listed only as 4S, so I assumed there must be some difference in the two. Is there no difference?

[OV10]

Hello pgiroma,
Firstly, the response given by Pheonix is incorrect. Here is the layman(non technical) breakdown on the S & P : S is for number of cells series, P is for number of cells parallel (for each serial connection).
Here's a good site reference. As they say a picture is worth a 1000 words. http://scriptasylum.com/rc_speed/lipo.html
Best regards,

[Konrad]

To add to Charlie's post when we say Xs there is an implied 1p. So 4s = 4s1p

Now a 2200 mAh 4s battery pack has 4 cells with the capacity of 2200 mAh each.

A 2200 mAh 4s2p battery pack has 8 cells with a capacity of 1100 mAh each.

They both have a nominal voltage of 14.8 volts and as they both have the same capacity they have the same power.

Parallel pack are used in high amp draw situation where one wants to spread the load over more cells. It was also used a lot in the early days of e-flight when we didn't have large mAh cells when we wanted more duration from the battery packs.

I hope this is clearer than ink.

All the best,
Konrad

[Bajora]

Back in the day .... :) .... there were some packs that were, say, 4S2P. I had some that I used on a review model way back when. The battery was basically, internally, two four cell packs that were then wired in parallel. It would be like us taking two individual four cell packs and connecting them in parallel to increase the net capacity of the battery we are putting in a model? Two four cell 1800mAh connected in parallel would give you a four cell 3600mAh, as most of you probably already know. But a 4S2P 1800mAh pack was actually two 1800mAh packs connected in parallel but all contained in one battery pack, with one output lead. IF memory serves. :)

[fhhuber]

Earlier it was common to see 4S 2P, 4s3P or even more ...

4S = 4 cells in series.
1P = 1 in parallel (not paralleled at all)

The origin of this is the early LiPos for RC models were essentially cell phone batteries combined to make up a pack useful for our purposes. The typical cell battery was 1 cell. The cell size was usually 200 mah to 800 mah. So in order to make up a 14.8v 2000 mah pack you might have to do something like 4S5P.

Now we have larger cells so there is less need to put cells in parallel.

We also used to have 4C to 12C as the norm with 20C being considered an extremely high discharge rating... now 20C is considered a low rate pack.

I have just had a custom harness made for my Freewing F-14 which will let me take 4 X 3S 4500 mah packs and use them in a 2S2P configuration for the equivalent of 6S2P, 9000 mah. since I have planes that run on 3S and can carry the 4500 mah packs this lets me make maximum use of the packs.

XS = in series: add the cell voltages
YP = in parallel: add the capacity.

2X 4S1P 1800 mah packs in parallel would be the same as 1X 4S2P 3600 mah

[Konrad]

Earlier it was common to see 4S 2P, 4s3P or even more ...

4S = 4 cells in series.
1P = 1 in parallel (not paralleled at all)

The origin of this is the early LiPos for RC models were essentially cell phone batteries combined to make up a pack useful for our purposes. The typical cell battery was 1 cell. The cell size was usually 200 mah to 800 mah. So in order to make up a 14.8v 2000 mah pack you might have to do something like 4S5P.

...

But mathematical viable as opposed to multiplying by Zero. After all this is an attempt to mathematically describe the configuration of the cells in the battery pack.

Even today the volume of cells sold to the RC industry is statistically insignificant when looked at total volume of sales as measured in grams of lithium in the secondary (rechargeable) battery market.

All the best,
Konrad

[Konrad]

I just got an education on battery packs, not that it makes any difference to me. I am sure whom ever asked this question, is real confused by now. Oh, what a little knowledge will do to some. As the old saying goes, "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing." Perhaps only those with aeronautical engineers' degrees should respond to threads. I will limit my participation to reading from now on.

Say what?

This has nothing to do with Aeronautics. And what does an engineering degree add to the discussion? Most of this is simple mathematics and the discussion of convention, when addressing battery nomenclature.

Why would gaining an education make no difference to you? And how would the explanation of the nomenclature add to the confusion. The OP admitted he didn't understand the nomenclature. We (I) may not have explained it. But I fail to see how my attempt would make him "real confused". It is hoped that he now has an understanding or has a basis to ask for clarification.

Now I have to ask how do you guys measure battery size? I use watt hours to describe the size of the battery.

All the best,
Konrad

P.S.
Maybe this explanation will help. The 1P is assumed to be there when writing out the battery description unless note otherwise. It is much like the denominator in mathematics. When you write 100 you really are say 100/1. Yet by convention we leave off the "/1".

[The Huff]

Say what?

This has nothing to do with Aeronautics. And what does an engineering degree add to the discussion? Most of this is simple mathematics and the discussion of convention, when addressing battery nomenclature.

Why would gaining an education make no difference to you? And how would the explanation of the nomenclature add to the confusion. The OP admitted he didn't understand the nomenclature. We (I) may not have explained it. But I fail to see how my attempt would make him "real confused". It is hoped that he now has an understanding or has a basis to ask for clarification.

Now I have to ask how do you guys measure battery size? I use watt hours to describe the size of the battery.

All the best,
Konrad

P.S.
Maybe this explanation will help. The 1P is assumed to be there when writing out the battery description unless note otherwise. It is much like the denominator in mathematics. When you write 100 you really are say 100/1. Yet by convention we leave off the "/1".

I use a digital caliper to measure my battery size .... ;)

[Konrad]

Lets not forget the gram scale !!!
The wife's dress makers tape works well for me.

[pgiroma]

Thanks to all. I did , in fact, understand the explanations, and it seems to me that adding the 1P is totally unnecessary, while if the configuration is 2P, 3P, etc it should be listed in the battery specs. While I have been modelling for more years than I want to admit, I am still in the learning phase when it comes to the electric phase.

[Konrad]

Glad to be of help.

Now to be fair we, (well I'm) always learning, trying to expand my education.

Some folks get a bit bent out of shape when discussing technical aspects as positions can be verified. I and most other don't point out the errors to be combative. We do so to be informative. I want all to be able to get out of this hobby at least as much as I have. And to that end knowledge is king!

I like to be "Proven wrong" as it means I learned something new.

All the best,
Konrad

[Konrad]

I need to remember that Konard reads and critiques most post as the expert. Although I have been flying for many years, I had to take time off in between school and deployments, and just started flying regularly about 2-years ago, I should stick to what I know best as a research scientist and in medicine. Although I find the post useful and actually learn much, I will limit my responses to those that involve hemorrhage (bleeding), and other cardio-vascular issues. This way I am sure I can provide accurate information.

What expert?
I commented to OV10's post with an expanded explanation. His link was adequate for most of the membership.
I commented to fhHuber's post more in jest (in the same spirit that he made about 1 not being parallel).

Actually I never said you or anyone else was in error. My posting style is to show what I believe/know and then offer supporting data. You as a research scientist have to do the same thing in your everyday work (well if you are a good one, and I assume you are).

All the best,
Konrad

[Konrad]

Don't be too sure on that.
We can have dueling CV's, but I wouldn't be too sure of the outcome.

May I ask why the retraction of the post? Are you not a man of your word and convictions? If you made an error or had a change of heart a simple apology would have been appropriate.

Loss of posts often results in threads being hard to follow. Please lets not do that here on Hobby Squawk. Besides I often quote the post I'm referencing.

All the best,
Konrad

[Aros]

Just a reminder to try our best to be respectful of each other's viewpoints. Keep in mind, writing styles, lack of visual cues like body language can often cause folks to take their messages wrong. It happens every day in millions of forums around the world. We are all friends here in the fact that we love this hobby and are always looking to commune with others. No PHDs or MD's required to post here. :)

[Pheonix]

You are right. All deleted.

[Konrad]

Konard, I do have to give you any reason why I removed my post and an apology is certainly not necessary. You have big "Balls" to question someone's integrity and conventions. If I remember correctly, we still live in a free country. Perhaps you should try to remember this. This is very last time I will use this forum. We have had dis-agreements in the past with you displaying how much knowledge you have in the hobby.

"If I remember correctly, we still live in a free country." Exactly, and I choose to enlighten those that will listen, for free!

All the best,
Konrad

[pgiroma]

It's too bad that my simple request for information degenerated into an ego contest.

[Konrad]

Don't let it bother you. It was an innocent and valid request. Here on Hobby Squawk we'll keep the doors to knowledge open for you.

All the best,
Konrad

[Davcrockett]

Wow.. That was differnet just asking what is a 1P. I was going to ask how do you size a motor, ESC, Prop and the right battery. Maybe I'll save it for another time.