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A comparison of older Admiral to new Graphene

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  • A comparison of older Admiral to new Graphene

    I fly a Saber X51 for sport, and have used a couple of Admiral 4Ah 4S batteries in it for a couple years, and they power it pretty well. I recently bought a Graphene 4Ah 4S battery for it, just to compare. I'm using a Castle Creations ESC, which records current, Voltage, rpm, etc., which I find rather useful. During a recent trip to the field, I flew the Saber four times, alternating between the Graphene and Admiral. The first three flights, after I took off, I turned down wind, slammed the throttle, and went vertical; the last flight I slammed full throttle right after lift off, going vertical, to get a sample of a max performance take off with the Admiral as fresh as possible. Results: the recorded data shows I had ~10% more power available with the Graphene, even with the somewhat fresher Admiral on the last flight; verticals were just stronger, too.

    Battery specs:
    Admiral: 14.1 oz. Dimensions, allowing for cable fit - 135x42x33. IR by cell - 4.52, 4.72, 5.52, 5.60
    Graphene: 17.6 oz, Dimensions - 150x50x35. IR - 1.85, 1.92, 1.88, 1.88

    In spite of the extra 3.5 ounces, the higher Voltage from the Graphene due to the lower total IR made for much better verticals and acceleration. Because of the increased size, they will not fit in my FMS P51, though; something to consider when looking for a better performing battery. I'm hoping the new Admirals are comparably better than my current ones in power delivery. My battery box is currently full, however, so until I wear out or destroy a few, that test will have to wait.

  • #2
    I just realized that these were the first full flights on the Graphene, so re-measured IR - 1.72, 1.76, 1.76, 1.68
    So, a clear break-in of the cells after a few flights providing about 80A maximum, ~30A average.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by WintrSol View Post
      I fly a Saber X51 for sport, and have used a couple of Admiral 4Ah 4S batteries in it for a couple years, and they power it pretty well. I recently bought a Graphene 4Ah 4S battery for it, just to compare. I'm using a Castle Creations ESC, which records current, Voltage, rpm, etc., which I find rather useful. During a recent trip to the field, I flew the Saber four times, alternating between the Graphene and Admiral. The first three flights, after I took off, I turned down wind, slammed the throttle, and went vertical; the last flight I slammed full throttle right after lift off, going vertical, to get a sample of a max performance take off with the Admiral as fresh as possible. Results: the recorded data shows I had ~10% more power available with the Graphene, even with the somewhat fresher Admiral on the last flight; verticals were just stronger, too.

      Battery specs:
      Admiral: 14.1 oz. Dimensions, allowing for cable fit - 135x42x33. IR by cell - 4.52, 4.72, 5.52, 5.60
      Graphene: 17.6 oz, Dimensions - 150x50x35. IR - 1.85, 1.92, 1.88, 1.88

      In spite of the extra 3.5 ounces, the higher Voltage from the Graphene due to the lower total IR made for much better verticals and acceleration. Because of the increased size, they will not fit in my FMS P51, though; something to consider when looking for a better performing battery. I'm hoping the new Admirals are comparably better than my current ones in power delivery. My battery box is currently full, however, so until I wear out or destroy a few, that test will have to wait.
      It would be very interesting to see this testing done with a comparable IR level Admiral that isn't a couple years old(assuming that's what you meant when you said couple years) ;)
      Warbird Charlie
      HSD Skyraider FlightLine OV-10 FMS 1400: P-40B, P-51, F4U, F6F, T-28, P-40E, Pitts, 1700 F4U & F7F, FOX glider Freewing A-6, T-33, P-51 Dynam ME-262, Waco TF Giant P-47; ESM F7F-3 LX PBJ-1 EFL CZ T-28, C-150, 1500 P-51 & FW-190

      Comment


      • #4
        The Admiral batteries are, indeed, 2 years old. The IR readings have not really changed after the initial break in - I measured them again when I re-measured the Graphene battery. The data recorded by the ESC tells the story; at peak power, the Voltage was lower with the Admiral batteries, and in direct proportion to the higher IR, given the current was also reduced. Lower Voltage means lower rpm, means lower power - pretty straightforward. I would love to try a new higher performance Admiral battery; if someone would send me one I'd give it a go.

        BTW, according to the algorithm Mr. Giles programmed into his meter, the Graphene batteries should deliver a steady 120A, while the Admirals just over 60A, and the model peaked a little over 76A with the Admiral battery, and just over 80A with the Graphene. I changed out the ESC from 75A to 100A before flying, as I anticipated the increased current.

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        • #5
          I just ordered one of the newer 6S 4000s today. I can post the IR numbers when it gets here.

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          • #6
            It appears the new batteries don't yet come in the 4S 4Ah size; the one found in search has the same specs as what I have. Oh, well, maybe later.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by WintrSol View Post
              It appears the new batteries don't yet come in the 4S 4Ah size; the one found in search has the same specs as what I have. Oh, well, maybe later.
              They sure are making the NEW 4S 4000
              The new label has 5 stars below the Admiral
              Old on left and NEW on right is longer and thinner
              Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_0604.JPG Views:	1 Size:	55.1 KB ID:	74297Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_0605.JPG Views:	1 Size:	41.8 KB ID:	74298

              I also got the new 6S 4500 40C and it is thinner than and longer than the old 4000 40C, yes that ain't a typo.
              This is the 4S 4000 I ordered which is the only one they show now. They removed the old style probably after they depleted it's inventory.
              Admiral 4000mAh 4S 40C LiPo Battery with XT60 Connector - EPR40004X6 Power you can trust! Admiral batteries are globally renowned for delivering superior power-to-weight ratio, reliable safety, and long lifespan. Produced in a world-class facility with an all-new formula that optimizes high performance across more cycl
              Warbird Charlie
              HSD Skyraider FlightLine OV-10 FMS 1400: P-40B, P-51, F4U, F6F, T-28, P-40E, Pitts, 1700 F4U & F7F, FOX glider Freewing A-6, T-33, P-51 Dynam ME-262, Waco TF Giant P-47; ESM F7F-3 LX PBJ-1 EFL CZ T-28, C-150, 1500 P-51 & FW-190

              Comment


              • #8
                I'm surprised that it was only 10% more performance with the Graphene. My seat of the pants tells me it's more but then, I get the next size mah down from what I normally use in a particular plane so the weights are the same. I get similar (if not slightly more) flight time with a noticeable bump in performance.

                Comment


                • #9
                  That isn't the 'Pro' version, so I assumed it is just the new manufacturer creating the same battery in a slightly different package. The new one is actually 0.5 ounce lighter, but the same C rating. The somewhat greater cell area may result in somewhat lower IR. I'm tempted by the 5Ah Pro - about the same weight as my Graphene, and I can deal with the somewhat increased length. The Graphene series has plates between the cells, which adds weight and thickness; not sure what they're for.

                  Yes, as I noted, there was a real bump in performance with the Graphene, even though it is so much heavier. If you aren't flying with a TM battery monitor, you might fly to a lower state of charge, since they retain that extra performance as they discharge. The fact that they stay cooler inside adds to the extra apparent life. The only way to be sure is to measure the resting Voltage after a flight.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by WintrSol View Post
                    I just realized that these were the first full flights on the Graphene, so re-measured IR - 1.72, 1.76, 1.76, 1.68
                    So, a clear break-in of the cells after a few flights providing about 80A maximum, ~30A average.
                    What brand graphenes were you running?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Twowingtj View Post

                      What brand graphenes were you running?
                      The first ones, from Hobby King.

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