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issues trying to upload a AS3X/safe select profile to AR637T

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  • issues trying to upload a AS3X/safe select profile to AR637T

    Hi all,

    i was given an eflite V900 from another club member without a receiver. i tried to buy the AR636 but looks to be discontinued so I bought the suggested replacement AR637T.

    i was hoping to follow the youtube tutorial from: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Np6CBNF0ZI

    I've registered the receiver and updated to the latest software however after that I cannot use the spectrum PC programming software to do anything else. all else apart from software updates is greyed out.

    Am I doing something wrong? is the AR637T not able to have profiles uploaded like the 636?

    I would like to fly the V900 with the stock setup as I've never played with AS3X and safe select would be useful for my first flights as this is my 4th plane.

    Thanks!


  • #2
    I don't have a 637T to play with but other flying buddies have. As for the 636, I've had mixed success with it. It depends on what plane it came out of. Those from certain planes (in my case, an Opterra) is "locked" and you can't do anything with it. However, I've been told that even with these, you can get a download from Spektrum that will wipe it clean so you can program it to your own specs. I've not done that yet so can't say if that's even possible. 636s that I've taken out of other planes have been re-programmable via my smart phone APP (with volume turned up to max). The APP can also be temperamental.
    The 637T shouldn't be a problem. Can you program it via "forward programming" through your transmitter? That seems the easiest way to do it. I haven't looked into how to load a pre-programmed file into it.

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi Xviper, thanks for the reply

      So from what i can see, it is not possible to use the PC spectrum programmer like on the 636. i found that i can view the standard V900 setup file using the pc programmer so i now have the gain values.

      So i guess i just have to add these manually using the forward programming through the Tx and then it should be the same as the stock plane?

      Found these videos on YT which should help: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxHT...D-8T-2&index=1

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks, I have those YouTube vids bookmarked for when I get my first 637T. Yes, those gains and priorities will give you the same AS3X characteristics. The only thing I'm not sure about is how to program in "safe select", which the BNF has. Perhaps you could get the club member who you got the plane from and see if he still has the stock RX and take the programming from it.

        Comment


        • #5
          i asked the guy at the club about the stock reviver however he sold it as soon as he got the plane as he runs futaba.

          so i went through the videos they confirm in the videos that the AR637T will only be programmed with the "forward programming" through the Tx.

          I setup up AS3X using the values i found and then set up safe using the videos from the link above. i flew the plane yesterday and the As3x is working great.

          The safe select values dont seem correct.

          i setup as follows:

          flight mode 1 = AS3X - rate gains (roll = 40% pitch = 60% yaw = 70%) - works great - 🙂

          flight mode 2 = AS3X + safe "Envelope" (gains - roll = 35 pitch = 35) (angle limits - roll = 75 pitch down = 40 pitch up = 50) - problem - when the angle limit is reached in roll the plane "bounces" back 🙁 - should I reduce the roll gain to 25?

          flight mode 3 = AS3X + safe "Self-level" (gains - roll = 35 pitch = 35) (angle limits - roll = 75 pitch down = 40 pitch up = 50) - problem - finding it really hard to turn in this mode, is seems like the settings are too high, not sure which one. 🙁

          any suggestions on the how to fix flight mode 2/3 which are using safe?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Gsky View Post
            problem - finding it really hard to turn in this mode, is seems like the settings are too high, not sure which one.[/B] 🙁

            any suggestions on the how to fix flight mode 2/3 which are using safe?
            "Safe" is a function in itself and is only indirectly affected by gain/priorities. If the stabilizer works as you like, best to leave gains alone. When you have it in SAFE and crank the AIL stick full roll, does it go to around 45 to 50 degrees of bank? If it does, I think that's the way it is. Banking in SAFE and using ELE does require quite a bit of space to do a complete turn around. You just have to learn to slow down a bit for the turn (without stalling) or only activate SAFE in emergencies or use it on final (as I do).

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Gsky View Post
              Hi Xviper, thanks for the reply

              So from what i can see, it is not possible to use the PC spectrum programmer like on the 636. i found that i can view the standard V900 setup file using the pc programmer so i now have the gain values.

              So i guess i just have to add these manually using the forward programming through the Tx and then it should be the same as the stock plane?

              Found these videos on YT which should help: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxHT...D-8T-2&index=1
              I just bought an AR637T and find it does not work with the PC application. I can update the firmware version (which I did), but nothing else works. All the menu options are greyed out. I have read it also does not work with the phone cable. It only works with the newest transmitters, which I don't have . So basically, there is no way I can program it, if I am understanding correctly. Is that right?

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Gringotuerto View Post

                I just bought an AR637T and find it does not work with the PC application. I can update the firmware version (which I did), but nothing else works. All the menu options are greyed out. I have read it also does not work with the phone cable. It only works with the newest transmitters, which I don't have . So basically, there is no way I can program it, if I am understanding correctly. Is that right?
                Correct. At this stage, the only way to program the newer receivers is through forward programming from the transmitter. From what I've seen, horizon reps are elusive as to the question of whether PC programming will be possible - but given the way that company conducts itself, I'd be very surprised if they did (i.e. they want us all to buy supported transmitters).

                OpenTX/MPM developers are working on implementation on those radios, with positive signs from early progress having been made.

                In theory you could use someone elses radio to program it, but again, knowing how they run their business I wouldnt be surprised if there's a catch that prevents you from doing so.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by mshagg View Post

                  Correct. At this stage, the only way to program the newer receivers is through forward programming from the transmitter. From what I've seen, horizon reps are elusive as to the question of whether PC programming will be possible - but given the way that company conducts itself, I'd be very surprised if they did (i.e. they want us all to buy supported transmitters).

                  OpenTX/MPM developers are working on implementation on those radios, with positive signs from early progress having been made.

                  In theory you could use someone elses radio to program it, but again, knowing how they run their business I wouldnt be surprised if there's a catch that prevents you from doing so.
                  I would not recommend having someone program it then switch radios to something that doesn't support forward programming. For one thing the receiver learns servo reversing from the transmitter. Trims, etc are also learned. It won't be able to learn these

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by mshagg View Post

                    Correct. At this stage, the only way to program the newer receivers is through forward programming from the transmitter.
                    Wow, that is the biggest "middle finger to the customer" I've ever encountered in any business, anywhere. It is kind of normal to overcharge for accessories and cables, but I already bought an overpriced USB cable from Spektrum. Then they quit supporting that, and I bought an overpriced phone cable from them. Now they obsolete that too and expect me to spend >$1000 just to program a receiver I already bought? No way - next transmitter I buy will definitely NOT be Spektrum, I'm done with these stupid games.

                    What is really irritating is that you KNOW that the developers have a UI simulator. That is the natural way to develop this - it is all written on computers, independent of the target hardware.


                    Originally posted by Gilatrout View Post

                    I would not recommend having someone program it then switch radios to something that doesn't support forward programming. For one thing the receiver learns servo reversing from the transmitter. Trims, etc are also learned. It won't be able to learn these
                    Well, if it works like the PC or phone application, all these things are set from the application (and can be stored there as a profile), but they are also stored in the receiver itself. Basically there are two levels....for example, there is a subtrim stored in the Rx, and then on top of that you could adjust subtrim in the Tx. So I think you could borrow a Tx if you only use it to set those items that are stored in the Rx. I assume all the items set by "Forward Programming" are stored in the Rx; but if you go to "Servo settings" or "D/R Expo" menu and set things on the borrowed Tx, then those are stored in the Tx, and would be lost when you bind to your own Tx.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Gringotuerto View Post

                      Wow, that is the biggest "middle finger to the customer" I've ever encountered in any business, anywhere. It is kind of normal to overcharge for accessories and cables, but I already bought an overpriced USB cable from Spektrum. Then they quit supporting that, and I bought an overpriced phone cable from them. Now they obsolete that too and expect me to spend >$1000 just to program a receiver I already bought? No way - next transmitter I buy will definitely NOT be Spektrum, I'm done with these stupid games.

                      What is really irritating is that you KNOW that the developers have a UI simulator. That is the natural way to develop this - it is all written on computers, independent of the target hardware.




                      Well, if it works like the PC or phone application, all these things are set from the application (and can be stored there as a profile), but they are also stored in the receiver itself. Basically there are two levels....for example, there is a subtrim stored in the Rx, and then on top of that you could adjust subtrim in the Tx. So I think you could borrow a Tx if you only use it to set those items that are stored in the Rx. I assume all the items set by "Forward Programming" are stored in the Rx; but if you go to "Servo settings" or "D/R Expo" menu and set things on the borrowed Tx, then those are stored in the Tx, and would be lost when you bind to your own Tx.
                      No, these are not set in forward programming. The receiver learns the travel, reversing, wing type etc from the transmitter directly.

                      Yes, it is software, and this technically could be set in an app. However, a lot of people lost planes because the settings in the computer were different from the transmitter. Using forward programming is a big improvement on the old method.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Gilatrout View Post

                        However, a lot of people lost planes because the settings in the computer were different from the transmitter. Using forward programming is a big improvement on the old method.
                        I'm not sure what you mean by "setting in the computer different from the Tx". Maybe what you mean is, for example, you have to set "reverse" in the receiver, because it is used both for the control surface direction and the gyro direction. If you set "reverse" on the Tx, and set up everything else correctly in the Rx, then the gyro will be wrong, because only the Tx side knows about the "reverse". That is why they repeat over and over in the instructions "DON'T DO THAT." But OK, I can see how if you tie everything to a single Tx, that can't happen.

                        However, IMHO it is not better, primarily because I prefer working with a computer with a big screen, a mouse, a keyboard, etc. It was very quick to set up. And I had access to my printer, to dropbox, etc, just like with any other PC application.

                        I can understand liking forward programming. But having options is a good thing, and actively removing options just to shaft customers is not an improvement. I would prefer using my computer, but probably more to the point, I would prefer not spending 10X to program a receiver that costs X. It is mildly irritating, but pretty standard, to pay a premium for a proprietary cable that costs a few percent of the price of the device you are trying to program. It is not standard when that is 1000% instead of a few percent.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Hey GSKY. Flt mode 1 should be inhibited
                          Flt mode 2 should be AS3X , NO flight envelope, and NO self - level, your gains and angle limits are just fine
                          Flt mode 3 should be SAFE, Self-level, gains set 50 & 75, angle limits should be 65,40,45
                          this should work just fine for your aircraft.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Also you should use a switch to toggle back and forth for as3x and safe, you should not have two as3x modes or two safe modes

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hey
                              can I use my bigaole with my ar637t receiver

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by Tsla View Post
                                Hey
                                can I use my bigaole with my ar637t receiver
                                I look up Bigaole, and I think it just sits in between the receiver and the servos and acts on standard PPM signals, so I don't see any reason why it would not work. Well, when I say "standard PPM signals", unfortunately there is not a rigorous testable standard for this, it is more like a "de-facto industry practice." The exact max/min pulse widths, exact signal voltage, ramp up/down, drive strength, etc. are not specified in any industry-recognized standard. But despite the lack of rigorous standards, I very seldom run into problems with PPM-based devices not working together.

                                So I guess that is a "highly likely yes."

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by Tsla View Post
                                  Hey
                                  can I use my bigaole with my ar637t receiver
                                  The AR637T is a gyro receiver. The Bigaole is also a gyro device. You CANNOT use 2 gyro devices inline. The stabilization of one will confuse and interfere with the stabilization of other. I know this because I've tried it on a plane with an AR636 and Bigaole. I even tried it using a Turnigy "buddy box", which can separate the signals of the 2 devices with the flip of a switch, whereby the Bigaole is downstream of a standard RX. This also, will NOT work. The plane will fly with one device but when you switch to the other, the plane goes crazy. Then, by changing channel reverse, the other device will work but when switched back to the first, the plane goes crazy.
                                  I did NOT try to zero all gains and priorities of the AR unit but then, if you're not going to use the gyro, why even have an AR unit? Use a standard receiver. You can also turn all gains to zero on the Bigaole, but then, the RTH function won't work. It needs the gyro for it to work the control surfaces.
                                  Your best choice if you want a gyro, RTH AND telemetry is to get the Bigaole and combine it with a standard receiver and the Lemon telemetry unit OR, get the Bigaole and combine it with one of the Lemon telemetry receivers (no gyro). I have flown planes with both types of setups (Bushmule and all my sailplanes) and it works superbly. In fact, I've had a sailplane up to 2500 feet and so far away, I couldn't even see it. I still got telemetry and with the flip of a switch, the plane would turn around and come home. Also, if combined with a Failsafe RX, the plane will also set throttle to come home. (Otherwise, throttle must be set manually for the trip home.)

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by xviper View Post
                                    The AR637T is a gyro receiver. The Bigaole is also a gyro device. You CANNOT use 2 gyro devices inline.
                                    Yes that is true but I assumed he meant turning off the gains in the AR637T. You can replace that function with the Bigaole and gain the extra functions that it has that 637 doesn't (like return to home). An AR637T with gains set to zero should be like a standard receiver.

                                    EDIT: Oh I see you mention that as an option above. I guess disabling anything is a waste in theory, but I have many installed parts with capabilities turned off, mostly because that's the equipment I had free at the moment I was putting together the plane. Anyway the key point is, I agree, it is best not to turn on two gyros. I think they might not oscillate, but they might, and it just isn't worth messing with.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by Gringotuerto View Post

                                      Yes that is true but I assumed he meant turning off the gains in the AR637T. You can replace that function with the Bigaole and gain the extra functions that it has that 637 doesn't (like return to home). An AR637T with gains set to zero should be like a standard receiver.
                                      That is clear to you and me but one can't make the assumption that it is clear to others. Not understanding this can result in a crash within seconds after take off. As I said before, there is no point in using a 637 to only use it as a standard RX and for it's telemetry. It's not a cheap RX. There are other much cheaper routes to take if you want the telemetry. Save the 637 for another plane.
                                      I am current setting up a plane with the 637 and during the build (testing and calibration, etc.), I've set NO gains and yes, it does act like a standard RX. I'll set up the gyro after the plane is finished.

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