E-Flite P-47 SAFE Anomaly

[Cobra1365]

Posted this in RCGroups as well

Also posted on the Razorback thread in the Warbirds section.

Ok, so an eventful morning!

First flight went good. Fought the sun coming in and landed just to right of runway. Not a stellar start!
Second flight, (after checking to ensure the off field first landing didn’t mess anything up). Took off and noticed I had trouble with my right turn out. Added a bit more aileron and that’s when I noticed I had no aileron control! It was flying away toward the highway. So, I immediately powered back and put full left rudder. She actually turned quite nicely on rudder only. Added a bit of power and made a complete 270* turn back toward the field, tho off one end of the runway. Cut power and made an off field landing. Farmer had harvested the alfalfa so I had plenty of open area. Checked every thing and had full control!
Third flight. Took off and immediately lost aileron again! Made a 180* with rudder only and reverse direction landing. This time, I had limited elevator as well! Again off field....sigh!

As we were standing over the airplane watching all the controls act normally, I looked down to ensure my throttle cut off was engaged. That’s when I noticed my SAFE select was engaged. I don’t fly with SAFE. It did not “limit” bank angle....it deleted it! Changed switch setting and flew normal.

I have SAFE on switch G (DX8 Gen 2). With 0 being engaged and 1-2 being off. Settings are 100/0/-100 respectively. Do I need to change the 100 to -100 in case I accidentally toggle that switch again? I’m really surprised it cancelled out any inputs!

Ideas?

Thanks

[xviper]

I can't comment on the cancelling of your control inputs, but I would suggest you do a re-bind WITHOUT "safe", since you say you don't use it anyway. As for the switch, it's better to use a 2-position switch, but in my case, I don't have a free 2-position switch available, so I use a 3-position, HOWEVER, I make sure I NEVER stop in the middle position. A 2-pos. switch sees +100 and -100. A 3-position switch sees the same but with "0" in the middle position. I'm not sure what these "safe select" receivers do when it sees "0", so I just don't let it see zero for long. When I flip the switch, I don't stop in the middle, even for a split second.

PS. If you bind with NO "safe select" and DON'T assign a switch, the AS3X simply stays on all the time.

[Cobra1365]

I’m in the same boat...no 2 position switch available.

The way I understand the instructions, I can bind with SAFE on all the time, or SAFE Select....either way, AS3X is active. There isn’t an option to bind without it SAFE though.

I never intentionally move that switch. Guess it’s going to be a preflight check every time! Wish I had a red guard to put on it! 🥴

NOTE: Just reread the instructions. Binding to the radio and THEN pulling bind plug will turn it off.

Thanks!

[xviper]

I’m in the same boat...no 2 position switch available.

The way I understand the instructions, I can bind with SAFE on all the time, or SAFE Select....either way, AS3X is active. There isn’t an option to bind without it SAFE though.

I never intentionally move that switch. Guess it’s going to be a preflight check every time! Wish I had a red guard to put on it! 🥴

NOTE: Just reread the instructions. Binding to the radio and THEN pulling bind plug will turn it off.

Thanks!

I think you are misinterpreting this whole "SAFE" thing. Safe is where the bank angles are limited - sometimes referred as SAFE SELECT. AS3X is the gyro stabilization mode. If you bind without safe select, you still have stabilization (AS3X). Then you can turn off AS3X. With safe select available, you can go from SAFE to AS3X.

IE, bind it one way and you have SAFE ON or AS3X ON. Bind the other way and you have AS3X ON or OFF.

PS. If you have SAFE ON, you can always tell by moving the plane on the bench even before you power it up to about 1/4 throttle. If you want to see if you have AS3X, you must move the throttle to at least 1/4 and then back to see the control surface response to AS3X. When SAFE is ON, move the plane and you will see the control surface move and stay there. With only AS3X ON, move the plane (after the throttle thing) and you will see the control surfaces respond and immediately go back to neutral even if you leave the plane at an angle.

[Cobra1365]

I think you are misinterpreting this whole "SAFE" thing. Safe is where the bank angles are limited - sometimes referred as SAFE SELECT. AS3X is the gyro stabilization mode. If you bind without safe select, you still have stabilization (AS3X). Then you can turn off AS3X. With safe select available, you can go from SAFE to AS3X.

IE, bind it one way and you have SAFE ON or AS3X ON. Bind the other way and you have AS3X ON or OFF.

PS. If you have SAFE ON, you can always tell by moving the plane on the bench even before you power it up to about 1/4 throttle. If you want to see if you have AS3X, you must move the throttle to at least 1/4 and then back to see the control surface response to AS3X. When SAFE is ON, move the plane and you will see the control surface move and stay there. With only AS3X ON, move the plane (after the throttle thing) and you will see the control surfaces respond and immediately go back to neutral even if you leave the plane at an angle.

Nope, I understand the difference. What was unclear to me were the binding directions and their interchanging “SAFE” and “ SAFE Select”. As I said, I went back and reread it again. Finally deciphered what they were saying. So, it is now bound without SAFE.

Either way, it doesn’t change what happened with it accidentally turned on this morning. I was full deflection on the stick and it was not responding. Rudder was the only thing that turned it. If a new to flying person had experienced it, I’m pretty sure they would have lost an airplane.

[RRHandy]

It sounds like to me that you had safe select on, like the apprentice it has safe select and panic mode and they are on two different switches, panic is on switch A and safe select (trainer or flight mode), is most likely on the flap switch, I move to switch B. if you have the flight mode switch in beginner or intermediate the plane will fly just as you describe with rudder doing the most turning with ailerons only moving like 5 deg.

Does this sound like what you seen? R.

[Cobra1365]

It sounds like to me that you had safe select on, like the apprentice it has safe select and panic mode and they are on two different switches, panic is on switch A and safe select (trainer or flight mode), is most likely on the flap switch, I move to switch B. if you have the flight mode switch in beginner or intermediate the plane will fly just as you describe with rudder doing the most turning with ailerons only moving like 5 deg.

Does this sound like what you seen? R.

Yes. As I mentioned, after looking down at my radio and seeing SAFE Select was on, I attributed the condition to it. But, the confusing part is I had zero aileron control. No roll at all.

It flew fine again, once I turned it off.

[RRHandy]

It's meant to bring the wings level and to keep a new pilot from rolling the plane over and to make them learn to fly with the rudder first then to ailerons. I guess I din't quite read the text right.

[Cobra1365]

It's meant to bring the wings level and to keep a new pilot from rolling the plane over and to make them learn to fly with the rudder first then to ailerons. I guess I din't quite read the text right.

Which is what I would expect to happen if I was in a bad condition and engaged it. I would, however, then expect it to behave like the Carbon Cub and just limit the bank angle. But, this one gave me zero bank angle. Very disconcerting.

Regardless, it is now bound without it and I flew three very enjoyable flights this AM.