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Official FlightLine RC 1600mm P-38 Lightning Thread

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  • I stumbled across this video on the P-38 on YouTube. Don’t remember seeing it posted before. So, thought I’d share...

    ---
    Warbirder

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    • I was gifted this airplane from the fleet of our eldest club member. He had flown it twice and determined it was a little too hot for him, he’s 94!!! It was setup on his Spektrum radio, but I didn’t get a chance to see his settings. It came complete with a Spektrum AR8010T receiver. I’m trying to set it up and bind it to my DX8 but must have the wing type off. After binding, the rudder, elevator and throttled work fine but the aileron stick moves the flaps....help please!

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      • Originally posted by Kurtzz View Post
        I was gifted this airplane from the fleet of our eldest club member. He had flown it twice and determined it was a little too hot for him, he’s 94!!! It was setup on his Spektrum radio, but I didn’t get a chance to see his settings. It came complete with a Spektrum AR8010T receiver. I’m trying to set it up and bind it to my DX8 but must have the wing type off. After binding, the rudder, elevator and throttled work fine but the aileron stick moves the flaps....help please!
        Sounds to me like you've got the flaps plugged into Ch.2 and AIL not plugged into anything if they don't move. You must first tell the TX that you have 1 AIL, 1 Flap as wing type. tail is normal. The ailerons should be "Y'd" together as should be the flaps. AIL get plugged into AIL (or channel 2) Flaps get plugged into AUX1 (or channel 6). Now, you must open up the flap menu so you can zero the flaps properly and assign the desired % deployment and deployment time and select the switch you want to use, typically switch D on Spektrum.

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        • Making headway, set the wing type in the DX8 to 1 ail, 1 flap. Went into the flap menu, set the switch, etc. now everything but the ailerons work. The receiver that is installed is the same one that flew the bird, all the previous owner did was take out his batteries, and hand me the bird, RTF. I need to check out the aileron connections at the wings. Must be something easy I’m overlooking.

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          • Originally posted by Kurtzz View Post
            Making headway, set the wing type in the DX8 to 1 ail, 1 flap. Went into the flap menu, set the switch, etc. now everything but the ailerons work. The receiver that is installed is the same one that flew the bird, all the previous owner did was take out his batteries, and hand me the bird, RTF. I need to check out the aileron connections at the wings. Must be something easy I’m overlooking.
            Do you have a servo tester? If so, pull the AIL plug from the RX and run it with the tester. If it works, then it's something to do with the RX or the way the TX is set up to recognize the AIL port. If it doesn't work, you must look further along the AIL lines.

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            • Originally posted by xviper View Post
              Do you have a servo tester? If so, pull the AIL plug from the RX and run it with the tester. If it works, then it's something to do with the RX or the way the TX is set up to recognize the AIL port. If it doesn't work, you must look further along the AIL lines.
              Thanks for the help xviper. Had a loose connection in the left wing aileron connector. I have set all the throws per the manual, dual rates also. Going to set the balance with 2 4S 2200 40c Turnigys, maybe re-maiden tomorrow.

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              • 2 X 2200, 4s might be a little on the light side but shove them all the way forward and see if it'll balance.

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                • Hey guys,

                  I waited at the field for 6 hours on Sunday for it to stop raining long enough to get in my maiden flight on my P38. It went well, but after only 2 1/2 circuits it started raining again and I had to bring it in, so it was a very short flight (yay, I made a decent landing). It just needed some up trim.

                  After I landed, at the end of the runway I had to make a sharp turn to avoid going into the mud!

                  Now this video isn't a fancy production, but my friend Jason worked hard to put this together for me and about 75% of it is the P38 so I'm going to go ahead and post it here. The featured P38 starts at the 1 minute mark. I love this plane!

                  Marc and Jason toughed out some bad weather just so Marc could maiden his P-38. Jason even managed to get on camera for once.

                  Marc flies FW & FL: AL37, MiG-29, T45,F4, A4, A10, F104 70 and 90, P38, Dauntless SBD, Corsair, B17, B24, B26 & P61, Lipp.P19, ME262, Komets, Vampire, SeaVixen, FMS Tigercat, FOX Glider & Radian XL.

                  Rabid Models foamies, including my 8' B17 & 9' B36... and my Mud Ducks! www.rabidmodels.com

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by themudduck View Post
                    It just needed some up trim.
                    Looking at your elevator when it was on the bench and just as you were rolling off, it looked perfectly level. This plane, as well as most twin boom planes require some "reflex" (ie, UP elevator) as their neutral position. On all of my twin boom planes, "some" up trim can be as much as 3 to 4 degrees of UP deflection. Whatever trim it needed to fly properly hands off at cruising speed, when you land, you should take out the trim and manually adjust the elevator so it looks just like it did with the trim. That's normal for this plane.

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                    • Originally posted by xviper View Post
                      Looking at your elevator when it was on the bench and just as you were rolling off, it looked perfectly level. This plane, as well as most twin boom planes require some "reflex" (ie, UP elevator) as their neutral position. On all of my twin boom planes, "some" up trim can be as much as 3 to 4 degrees of UP deflection. Whatever trim it needed to fly properly hands off at cruising speed, when you land, you should take out the trim and manually adjust the elevator so it looks just like it did with the trim. That's normal for this plane.
                      Gotta respectfully disagree with ya XV on your comment that I put in bold print.
                      Every twin boom that I've flown had neutral E because the weight distribution for CG was appropriate for both norm/invert flight envelopes.
                      The only one that didn't is the FL P-38 which did require 4 degrees up E and that is because it is a well known fact (after I exposed the issue) that appropriate aft placement of twin 3000-4000mAh batteries to achieve proper CG at norm/inverted flight envelopes was restricted by the physical blockage of the aluminum L/E structure of the center wing through the fuselage and not due to misinformed beliefs of issues regarding incidence, compressibility or reflex. ;)
                      Because of this unusually heavy up E to counter the unchangeable nose heavy characteristic, inverted flight for this P-38 requires almost full down pressure to hold level flight which makes it a little unnerving:Scared:
                      Warbird Charlie
                      HSD Skyraider FlightLine OV-10 FMS 1400: P-40B, P-51, F4U, F6F, T-28, P-40E, Pitts, 1700 F4U & F7F, FOX glider Freewing A-6, T-33, P-51 Dynam ME-262, Waco TF Giant P-47; ESM F7F-3 LX PBJ-1 EFL CZ T-28, C-150, 1500 P-51 & FW-190

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by OV10 View Post

                        Gotta respectfully disagree with ya XV on your comment that I put in bold print.
                        It is your right to do so based on your experience and I honor that. My experience points towards the opposite. My first P-38 (FMS) had several degrees of reflex. The Freewing one also had it (reported by more than just the occasional owner). My First A-10 (LX) was not a twin boom but twin rudder, but required lots of reflex and was posted by several people experiencing the same thing (also reported with pics posted by many). My current Freewing A-10 also needs it. My HobbyKing Vampire requires it as does my 90mm Freewing Venom (also reported by many). Departing the twin boom planes, we now see that the new V2 F/A-18 (and the old V1 as well) states in the manual that some "reflex" should be manually set on the elevators as the neutral position based on the mid-panel line, but looking at it from the side profile, it is also clear that there is built in UP elevator regardless of the line reference. Then comes the B-26 Marauder from Dynam. In that case, many have said that there was some sort of manufacturing irregularity that made setting some reflex required, although some have said that the plane just didn't scale down very well from the real one to the model. Personally, I don't know. I just fly mine with whatever it takes for it to fly right. I've only ever heard of this in foamies and never in balsa built planes.
                        I guess we simply experience different things with similar planes. I just wanted to let themudduck know that what he experienced was not out of the ordinary.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by xviper View Post
                          It is your right to do so based on your experience and I honor that. My experience points towards the opposite. My first P-38 (FMS) had several degrees of reflex. The Freewing one also had it (reported by more than just the occasional owner). My First A-10 (LX) was not a twin boom but twin rudder, but required lots of reflex and was posted by several people experiencing the same thing (also reported with pics posted by many). My current Freewing A-10 also needs it. My HobbyKing Vampire requires it as does my 90mm Freewing Venom (also reported by many). Departing the twin boom planes, we now see that the new V2 F/A-18 (and the old V1 as well) states in the manual that some "reflex" should be manually set on the elevators as the neutral position based on the mid-panel line, but looking at it from the side profile, it is also clear that there is built in UP elevator regardless of the line reference. Then comes the B-26 Marauder from Dynam. In that case, many have said that there was some sort of manufacturing irregularity that made setting some reflex required, although some have said that the plane just didn't scale down very well from the real one to the model. Personally, I don't know. I just fly mine with whatever it takes for it to fly right. I've only ever heard of this in foamies and never in balsa built planes.
                          I guess we simply experience different things with similar planes. I just wanted to let themudduck know that what he experienced was not out of the ordinary.
                          Hey guys,

                          Yes I started with the surfaces all dead even. On the video the takeoff looks normal but ti didn't want to come up at first, and during the flight I did need to apply some u p trim because it was pushing down. But the amount of up trim needed was slight... like, 4 to 6 clicks, something like that. It was just normal adjusting for the first flight.

                          Its possible it just may have been a little nose-heavy - the batteries were in the middle position on the tray, Unfortunately I didn't have enough flight time to test for that using the flight techniques that we're used to doing, but I'll try again when I have another chance to fly it for longer than 1 minute and will report back.

                          I will say that I do have experience with a number of FL planes and the CG in the manual has been nose-heavy on virtually all of them. I'm fine with their recommendation as a starting position, since the planes are more stable that way, but most of these planes seem to fly more correctly with the CG moved back a little. The big A10 is a perfect example. When its balanced correctly its a lot better at flaring for the landing (and easier on the nose wheel). T
                          he Marauder on the other hand, needed the entire stab adjusted - it had nothing to do with the CG.

                          Marc flies FW & FL: AL37, MiG-29, T45,F4, A4, A10, F104 70 and 90, P38, Dauntless SBD, Corsair, B17, B24, B26 & P61, Lipp.P19, ME262, Komets, Vampire, SeaVixen, FMS Tigercat, FOX Glider & Radian XL.

                          Rabid Models foamies, including my 8' B17 & 9' B36... and my Mud Ducks! www.rabidmodels.com

                          Comment


                          • The weather is finally cooperating! Friday night was perfect and I had three nice flights with the Lightning, got the trims sorted out and adjusted the flaps. What a cool plane!

                            Couple of things I noticed: I moved the batteries back a bit and I didn't need as much "up" trim. I did need to crank in some aileron trim, which is a bit odd but not a big deal. (On some models I have added small clear plastic "trim tabs" to help, I may do that later so that I can even out the ailerons). But this plane flies so nice... really stable and I can do these really gigantic "power loops" which is so awesome. I am finding that it reallty likes a tiny touch of coordinated rudder in the turns.

                            The only adjustment I made was to was to program in a little down elevator trim with the flaps, and now the model doesn't balloon at all and handles really well for landing. I did find that I have to land with the throttle cracked open just a bit, or I lose elevator authority for the flare. After three five-minute flights at various power settings, the batteries were at 3.8 volts each time which is just about perfect. (I am using twin 2500mah admiral-pro packs).
                            I imagine that after two years, everyone else on this thread already knows all this stuff..... but I'm excited since this plane is new for me. :P I am looking forward to tomorrow, its going to be a great day for flying.

                            My friend Josh chased me with his quad, shooting air-to-air video, and edited this cool new video which is on YouTube.

                            Marc flies FW & FL: AL37, MiG-29, T45,F4, A4, A10, F104 70 and 90, P38, Dauntless SBD, Corsair, B17, B24, B26 & P61, Lipp.P19, ME262, Komets, Vampire, SeaVixen, FMS Tigercat, FOX Glider & Radian XL.

                            Rabid Models foamies, including my 8' B17 & 9' B36... and my Mud Ducks! www.rabidmodels.com

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by tdevince View Post
                              Aros,
                              Just went back to the build video. There it states "65mm-75mm is the recommended balanced with the model upright and the landing gear down". Going closer to 75mm will definitely help, I'm going to recheck that value and see what I get.

                              Update: with the model upright and gear down I get 72mm for the CG. Adding the drop tanks changes to 74mm. So I'm at the aft portion of the recommended range without adding any nose weight.

                              I also had troubles to interpret the CG drawing in the manual.
                              With 2x 2600 as far forward as can get, I measured with gears up, and at the beginning of the wing after the radius at the center fuselage. I received a CG of nearly 80mm and was pretty much confused. I don't have light-weight Lipos, so I couldn't understand it. I suspected that my CG measuring was wrong and tried to get information in the forums.

                              Above mentioned information helped a lot. LG down and measuring the CG at the outer fuselages brought me to 75mm.

                              Can anybody describe the change of her behavior between 65 and 75mm? Is she getting tail-heavy at 75mm? Some planes are pretty sensitive to CG change of 10mm.

                              I could also try if my 2x 3000 packs fit in and check CG. They are a bit older and therefore not my preferred packs for maiden flight, but would help bring CG forward without adding dead weight.

                              Comment


                              • I am using 2 x 2500mah orange admiral 4S batteries, and they sit all the way at the back of the tray. In the middle of the tray the plane was definitely nose-heavy, because flight-testing confirmed it: when the model was inverted it dove sharply towards the ground. Now, with the batteries at the back, when I go inverted I just need a touch of down elevator to maintain level flight inverted, which means it is balanced correctly.

                                Now back in my hanger, with the gear down and the batteries in place at the back of the tray, the measured balance point is 25mm in front of the main spar line on the wing (the crease in the foam), using my fingers underneath the wing on a hard point.
                                Try balancing your plane there and test-fly it to see how you like it. That is where I like it.

                                Keep in mind that with most MRC planes the recommended CG is a little too far forward, which is a good starting point. But if your plane is too nose heavy you'll have trouble with the flare during landings (like landing a brick), and also you'll need some up-trim to fly level.

                                BTW I have my timer set for 5 minutes of "happy fun time" with the 2500's and I end up at around 3.75 volts per cell pretty consistently.
                                Marc flies FW & FL: AL37, MiG-29, T45,F4, A4, A10, F104 70 and 90, P38, Dauntless SBD, Corsair, B17, B24, B26 & P61, Lipp.P19, ME262, Komets, Vampire, SeaVixen, FMS Tigercat, FOX Glider & Radian XL.

                                Rabid Models foamies, including my 8' B17 & 9' B36... and my Mud Ducks! www.rabidmodels.com

                                Comment


                                • Thank you for your support! Meanwhile, I checked CG with my two old 3000 packs --> 67mm.

                                  What do you mean with " the main spar line"? Where is the cease you refer to? Upside or downside of the wing?:Confused:

                                  It's hard to understand the location of your CG, as you use a different reference point. As far as I understand, putting your batteries all the way back of the tray should bring you to a CG which should be far beyond the recommended 65mm, and your CG is flight proven?

                                  Comment


                                  • I fly with 2500-3000 Admiral packs and I have them as far back as both can go... No CG measurement. Sorry :Straight-Face: But she flies great. I will say, I have MAX deflection on all control surfaces, just like all my warbirds, BUT, I use a lot of expo.... 45 AIL, 65 ELEV, and 20 RUDDER. This gives me full control in emergencies, but tames everything down. My buddy says the elevator is mushy to him. It does require more stick input, but you really have to try to get a high speed stall or over control.... I have dialed it down on a few birds, but the elevator will kill you, especially if you are slightly tail heavy.... One last thing. The "neutral" setting for the elevator on the 38 is a few MM about level. Hope this helps a bit!!! :Cool: Jerry

                                    Comment


                                    • I guess we all interpret things a little differently. To me, it's crystal clear. The "main spare line" is generally the thickest (from top to bottom) of the wing cross section. This is usually about 1/3 of the distance from the leading to the trailing edge. In the picture below, the main spar line is that line (or crease) just below the CG line that's drawn for our reference. The instructions use a measurement from the leading edge near the wing root (next to the fuse) and 65mm to the rear of that. The "wing root", as depicted in this picture, is at the end of the straight line of the leading edge of the wing, where it begins to curve forward into the fuselage. Themudduck is using a slightly difference reference point because that crease is easier to discern while some people have a hard time figuring out where the straight part of the leading edge stops and begins to curl. So, he's saying the CG is 25mm in front of the main spar line. If you look at the picture, the next line (crease on the wing) that the CG is just "in front" of, is quite clear. Nevertheless, whether it be XXmm from the leading edge or XXmm in front of the crease, we're talking the same thing. Besides, the CG in the book is a recommendation and a starting point. Actually flying balance point can vary from one pilot to the next dependent upon their feel and comfort zone. I used Admiral Pro 3600's all the way back and the plane flew fine. You want nose heavy over tail heavy whenever possible. Tail heavy can be dangerous.

                                      Click image for larger version  Name:	Annotation 2019-07-04 102036.png Views:	0 Size:	138.7 KB ID:	204413

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                                      • Guys, by "main spar line" I was just trying to refer to something that would easy to see - when you look at the plane looking down , like in the picture XViper posted, you can see a straight line on the top of the wing going from wingtip to wingtip. That's what I was looking at. Its not the actual spar, or the thickest part of the wing, its just the molded line in the foam.

                                        Since its a line it makes a handy reference point. Well, that's what I thought, I thought it would make this easy... but sorry to confuse everyone. With the batteries back in the tray, my plane balances 25mm ahead of that line. Which... according to XViper's drawing, would match the 65mm back from the LE of the wing at the inside of the nacelles (which is really hard to pinpoint) according to the drawing. So if 25mm in front of the "spar line" = 65mm behind the LE of the wing at the inside of that motor nacelle, then my plane balances exactly where the manual says?? Hmmm, interesting. I didn't read the manual. I flew the plane and came up with that on my own! I guess I done good! LOLLOL
                                        Marc flies FW & FL: AL37, MiG-29, T45,F4, A4, A10, F104 70 and 90, P38, Dauntless SBD, Corsair, B17, B24, B26 & P61, Lipp.P19, ME262, Komets, Vampire, SeaVixen, FMS Tigercat, FOX Glider & Radian XL.

                                        Rabid Models foamies, including my 8' B17 & 9' B36... and my Mud Ducks! www.rabidmodels.com

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by themudduck View Post
                                          Guys, by "main spar line" I was just trying to refer to something that would easy to see - when you look at the plane looking down , like in the picture XViper posted, you can see a straight line on the top of the wing going from wingtip to wingtip. That's what I was looking at. Its not the actual spar, or the thickest part of the wing, its just the molded line in the foam.

                                          Since its a line it makes a handy reference point. Well, that's what I thought, I thought it would make this easy... but sorry to confuse everyone. With the batteries back in the tray, my plane balances 25mm ahead of that line. Which... according to XViper's drawing, would match the 65mm back from the LE of the wing at the inside of the nacelles (which is really hard to pinpoint) according to the drawing. So if 25mm in front of the "spar line" = 65mm behind the LE of the wing at the inside of that motor nacelle, then my plane balances exactly where the manual says?? Hmmm, interesting. I didn't read the manual. I flew the plane and came up with that on my own! I guess I done good! LOLLOL

                                          That's how I understand the manual too, LE to the nacelle, not the fuselage.

                                          match the 65mm back from the LE of the wing at the inside of the nacelles (which is really hard to pinpoint)

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