Typical Freewing EDF aileron rate recommendations

[Levendis]

Just wanted to see if there are other folks out there who find that MRC written manuals for EDFs typically recommend aileron control rates WAY more than preferred after initial flight tuning.

I did an informal survey amongst Freewing jet flying members in my club, and four out of five believe that the recommended throws are 2-3x more than what they end up flying with. Selection of jets include Mirage, T-45, Mig-21, Avanti S, Stingers, Yak130s, F-15s, F-16s of different sizes, etc...

So we often resort to automatically dialing down the rates by half and moving in 1-2 holes on the servo arm to preserve control resolution, often creating some unintended differential in the control surface. More so for aileron control, but somewhat so for elev control as well.

I understand that this topic has come up across the hall (RCG) before, and that different folks have different preferances. (The one member at our club with the dissenting opinion flies mostly helis with no stick tension and has contest-grade mid-stick controlling ability haha). But just want to seek your thoughts to see if the four of us just have exceedingly dumb thumbs.

Just a few suggestions that I hope will be constructive>
1) in the manuals specify the name of the pilot who did the recommendation (i.e. say Alpha or Ryan) so if there is a systematic difference we could at least expect what the rates will be like.
2) specify the recommended EXPO setting for each control axis when used with those throws
3) dial the recommended rates down a little in the manuals? After all, after the customer gets used to the plane and know what they are doing; they could always dial them back up.

Your thoughts?

[petefoss]

I'd love a table of typical settings pilots have settled on for different planes, Dan Landis maidened my 90 mm F-104 and remarked that my 80% of recommended throws were too much for both elevator and aileron. That was with 10% expo since I hate flying with a lot of expo. I'll probably increase to 20 but no more.

Pete

[bill34207]

I tend to agree that the published throws are a lot more than I will typically fly with. The only real exception to this would be from the Stinger 90. With it the recommended throws worked well (other than the flaps that I increased in landing mode).
Typically I do my initial setup with the high rate on my high rate switch, low rate on the mid rate switch and my guess at a flyable rate in the low rate position. (In many cases, my guess becomes the new high rate)

[F106DeltaDart]

I would also add the 80mm F-86 as an exception. I fly both stock high/low rates with 20% expo, and it flys great. I believe the rates for the 64mm Panther were spot on as well. For the 70mm F-104, I used Alpha's rates and CG from RCgroups and it flys very well. The stock rates were a bit high in comparison to those. For the 90mm F-16, I used the rates from the flight review video, and never had an issue. Would be nice to have all of these various settings available in one place though.

[scooter genie]

I typically tone down the rates also. I've had 2 maidens where the roll rate was almost too much for me to handle. But I'm a thumb guy, so that may have something to do with it,

[AZFlyer]

I would agree that the rates are generally too liberal in the manual. I ran into one situation (can't remember which plane) where the recommended rates were almost twice what the servo could deliver. I couldn't come close to giving it that much throw.

I've found it best to maiden at the last hole on the control horn (all control surfaces) and a throw rate of about 60-70% with 30% expo. That has generally been my low rate setting and it's always served me well for maiden flights. The only plane I own that I've had to dial down the rate considerably is the Freewing F-16C 70mm plane. I've also heard the F-104 needs to dial WAY down to about 40%. Agreed the F-86 is probably an exception. It needs lots of throw on the surfaces, and it flies great.

On all planes, I usually go high rates after taking off to be sure I have enough throw for aerobatics and such, but then I dial back down for landing. May be crazy, but that's how I roll.

Hope this helps.

[gooniac33]

this is all a matter of preference. But I can share my thoughts...

I set up my planes to fly one way with the only switches being for gear, flaps, air brake or throttle cut. I rarely go with the settings in the manuals since I kinda have an idea what the planes will do in the air. I am an expo guy as well. I used lots of it just because of the way that I fly. 40-60% on ailerons, 20-50% on elevator and 70-90% on rudder for good ground handling.

Also keep in mind that the CG recommended in the manual can be wrong as well. The 80mm F-5 is a good example of that. They make it far too nose heavy and it flies like a pig if set up as they say. I think that I have most of the planes you listed and can go through and let you know what I have done for each one.