Freewing F16 70mm EDF v2 6S Pro outrunner motor burnout and failure mid flight

[Royalstorm]

Hey guys,

i was in my 6th flight on my Freewing F16 6S Pro when about 2 minutes into the flight, smoke suddenly trailed out of the back nozzle and all thrust cut out. I was at full power but didn't have enough speed or altitude to bring her all the way back. I did still have control surface ability but wasn't able to safely land and she crashed. I was using an Admiral 22.2V 4000mah 60 C pack.

The outrunner motor is literalky charred and has a burnt smell. This has to be a defect, right. I'm attaching a picture of the motor still intact to show the charred appearance. I notified motion RC who initially said they can't do anything but after insisting that this was a faulty motor, they are requesting that I send in the EDF for inspection. Thoughts?

Here is the pic. Also YouTube link of the onboard video of the flight.

[Royalstorm]

EDF with obvious charred appearance

[F106DeltaDart]

Sorry to hear that Royalstorm, definitely looks burnt to me. I had the same thing happen with the Freewing 12-blade 6S unit when I purchased it from RC Castle, before Motion began stocking them. Luckily, after a few emails, they agreed to replace to send a replacement unit. I would send it in and hope for the best. Let us know what happens, Motion is generally very good about replacing things that failed due to a factory defect.

[Royalstorm]

Thx for the reply F106DeltaDart. Did they simply replace the EDF or the whole plane, since any crash and damage are due to the faulty engine?

[F106DeltaDart]

Thx for the reply F106DeltaDart. Did they simply replace the EDF or the whole plane, since any crash and damage are due to the faulty engine?

RC Castle only replaced the unit, but I was able to belly land the plane in tall grass without hardly any damage. They didn't replace my fried ESC either. In my crash, the burned motor overloaded the ESC, but the BEC continued working, similar to yours. I'm hoping that Motion will come through and make things right due to the engine failure. I don't know how bad the damage is from the crash, but I would think that a new unit, ESC, and fuselage would be a fair replacement, especially since you have onboard video of the whole thing.

[AZFlyer]

I have about 30 flights on my Freewing F-16 with the same battery and no problem at all. I fly it pretty hard, too. Sounds like a defect somewhere in the power system.

That being said, however, after watching your video, you were on that pretty hard. For the 2 minutes of flight, I'll bet you were at full power for a good 1 minute and 40 seconds of it. Sounded like something in the power system started to waffle about 10 seconds before it gave out.

Not sure what the expectations are for these kind of power systems (i.e., whether you can stand on full throttle for that long), but I would think that a brand new plane like that should be able to take it, unless you're in some crazy hot weather and just abusing the thing over and over again.

Hope it works out for you. Sorry to hear about the loss.

[Royalstorm]

I appreciate your post, AZFlyer. I was flying at near full throttle for the majority of the flight, though I would expect the Pro version on a 60C battery to be able to handle it.

And I agree with your observation about the power system waffling. You can see the camera begin shaking as well during the last pass before I make the final turn, suggesting some abnormal vibration. In any case, we'll see what Motion does. I'll keep you posted.

[Royalstorm]

RC Castle only replaced the unit, but I was able to belly land the plane in tall grass without hardly any damage. They didn't replace my fried ESC either. In my crash, the burned motor overloaded the ESC, but the BEC continued working, similar to yours. I'm hoping that Motion will come through and make things right due to the engine failure. I don't know how bad the damage is from the crash, but I would think that a new unit, ESC, and fuselage would be a fair replacement, especially since you have onboard video of the whole thing.

i just pulled the engine and it's definitely toast. How can I tell if the ESC is fried too?

[F106DeltaDart]

i just pulled the engine and it's definitely toast. How can I tell if the ESC is fried too?

You'll have plug it into another motor and test it out if possible.

[T-drizzle]

Major bummer man that really sucks but Motion should take care of you, plus I have had a similar issue although my Viper didn't fall out the air. -I've had my doubts and problems with the Pro 2300kv outrunner/12b 70mm impeller combo. I love my F16 Pro, I think it has a really considerable amount of thrust for what it is. Removed the edf combo weighs less then 200 grams so even if it only pumps out 2kgs of thrust that's a hell of a edf combo. Although I don't have an accurate way to measure thrust I know it puts out more than that so I've been curious since I read about this new Freewing 2300kv motor months ago.

I physically test everything before it goes in the air, not that I don't trust Motion I do, but my OCD is another story. After building the jet I tested it via watt-meter statically with a few different 6s packs and the highest numbers were on a Graphene 3000 65C where it peaked at 95 amps and settled to about 90 amps. A CHL 2700 50C was the smallest battery I used and the settled amps were still around 82-84. So with the factory 80 amp speedy I felt the need to throw in a 100A Hobbywing just to make sure.

It shouldn't matter how you fly, nowhere in the description does it say, "full throttle runs should be kept under 10 seconds" or something along those lines. This is Freewing and Motion RC, the model to my understanding can be flown however fast you want. If I'm wrong someone please feel free to correct me.

Now, I don't fly full out the whole time, I'm restricted due to the space I have to fly and I also go conservative on my lipos, especially my 6s collection. And I also don't fly much over 50-60%(3.8-85v a cell)depleted unless I get into a sticky situation and have to make multiple finals. The reason I say all this is to show I take it relatively easy yet the last 6 flights I had on her the motor came down 140-155F and they were not back to back flights. On hot setups I always use minimal throttle after landing to cool the motor for a good minute or 2, especially if it's an outrunner. Regardless, that high temperature is a sure fire way to fall out the sky so I threw together a DMT-2200KV inrunner/FMS 12b in a Freewing alloy shroud and balanced it. Only a little quiter then the stock outrunner but still all air crushing jet engine sound. Pulls around 90-95 amps constant but with the full cooling sleeve on the motor plus temp grease it stays cool even after a 4-5 min flight. The hottest reading I grabbed so far was 115F while the ambient was 85-90F and the humidity off the charts.

So maybe I got a lemon too, maybe lipo technologies are advancing too quick for the hardware, I don't know. But I do know I expressed this issue on RCG and I wasn't the only one so good luck to anyone keeping their stock Pro setup. Hope this helps. ;)

[Royalstorm]

Major bummer man that really sucks but Motion should take care of you, plus I have had a similar issue although my Viper didn't fall out the air. -I've had my doubts and problems with the Pro 2300kv outrunner/12b 70mm impeller combo. I love my F16 Pro, I think it has a really considerable amount of thrust for what it is. Removed the edf combo weighs less then 200 grams so even if it only pumps out 2kgs of thrust that's a hell of a edf combo. Although I don't have an accurate way to measure thrust I know it puts out more than that so I've been curious since I read about this new Freewing 2300kv motor months ago.

I physically test everything before it goes in the air, not that I don't trust Motion I do, but my OCD is another story. After building the jet I tested it via watt-meter statically with a few different 6s packs and the highest numbers were on a Graphene 3000 65C where it peaked at 95 amps and settled to about 90 amps. A CHL 2700 50C was the smallest battery I used and the settled amps were still around 82-84. So with the factory 80 amp speedy I felt the need to throw in a 100A Hobbywing just to make sure.

It shouldn't matter how you fly, nowhere in the description does it say, "full throttle runs should be kept under 10 seconds" or something along those lines. This is Freewing and Motion RC, the model to my understanding can be flown however fast you want. If I'm wrong someone please feel free to correct me.

Now, I don't fly full out the whole time, I'm restricted due to the space I have to fly and I also go conservative on my lipos, especially my 6s collection. And I also don't fly much over 50-60%(3.8-85v a cell)depleted unless I get into a sticky situation and have to make multiple finals. The reason I say all this is to show I take it relatively easy yet the last 6 flights I had on her the motor came down 140-155F and they were not back to back flights. On hot setups I always use minimal throttle after landing to cool the motor for a good minute or 2, especially if it's an outrunner. Regardless, that high temperature is a sure fire way to fall out the sky so I threw together a DMT-2200KV inrunner/FMS 12b in a Freewing alloy shroud and balanced it. Only a little quiter then the stock outrunner but still all air crushing jet engine sound. Pulls around 90-95 amps constant but with the full cooling sleeve on the motor plus temp grease it stays cool even after a 4-5 min flight. The hottest reading I grabbed so far was 115F while the ambient was 85-90F and the humidity off the charts.

So maybe I got a lemon too, maybe lipo technologies are advancing too quick for the hardware, I don't know. But I do know I expressed this issue on RCG and I wasn't the only one so good luck to anyone keeping their stock Pro setup. Hope this helps. ;)

Thanks for your post. Motion should have my engine now so hopefully I'll hear back soon. I'll keep you posted!

[Royalstorm]

Looks like Motion is going to replace the EDF and fan! I haven't had a chance to test out the ESC, so we'll see if it survived once the EDF arrives (which of course is currently out of stock on Motion's website).

[Baqar]

Hello guys hope you all have good day
i am having trouble with this plane and I need some expert advise my plane does a barrel roll in mid air just after a perfect take and goes into nose dive and hits the ground I have done it three or four times I have repaired and bought new kit as well I changed ailerons servos remove flight controller fixed battery now I don’t know why this time it crashed
it straight away went into right roll van any one help me please thanks