Does anyone have The Flex Cessna 170 and Carbon Z Cub?

[CZ Flyer]

Wondering how the two planes compare. Both are Quique Somenzini designs so I hesitated on getting the 170 since I have the cub and thought they might be too similar. Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks! Ron

[dkalwishky]

I have the Flex 170 and a buddy has the CZ Cub. We've compared notes on both planes; if you are going to fly 3D with the plane then the 170 is probably the way to go. If you are going to fly closer to scale with aerobatics then both planes are pretty equal in my opinion..

I will mention that I've flown my 170 in 25 mph winds and the Aura 8 really steadies things out, it's a joy to fly in the wind.

I went with the 170 over the Cub because I love the full scale 170's.

The 170 is $100 more than the Cub which is the cost of the Aura 8 flight controller. it's a really neat piece of hardware and out of the box it does not need any tweaking BUT if you like to tinker then the Aura can be have it's programming modified via a laptop.

[Ole-Timer]

I only have the 170 and although it flies very well, the quality is nowhere near the asking price. Very cheaply made. Not impressed at all.

[dkalwishky]

I would agree with what Ole-Timer wrote.

[CZ Flyer]

I would agree with what Ole-Timer wrote.

WOW! Thanks to both of you for the feedback! You just saved me $500... I commented on a Youtube video from the Flite Test guys about Quique's Mamba biplane. I asked, "Anyone else notice the floppy spindly landing gear?" They flop around worse than a Parkzone sport cub gear, but the plane costs $300+...

[rifleman_btx]

Oh hell. That makes me hesitate on the cap 232 I was thinking on now.

[Pauly]

A friend of mine has the Cap 232 and to see him fly it and to hear it is awesome. Only the is at the time he was cutting up really hard for several minutes and flipped a couple of times and lost elevator control and was in a dive and just before he hit the ground he went full throttle and it hit the ground belly first. And we were Wow along with a few other words. Guys, it you seen this you wouldn't believe it. Only thing it did was flatten out the Landing Gear. We picked it up went to the bench and bent the LG back into position and it was ready to go. He for some reason the control rod came lose from the control horn. Now, when I say he was flying it hard he was throwing a lot 3D moves on it. Time will tell on it. He also has the new Flex Mamba and it looked and appeared to handle well. I know he those 2 by Flex as well as the QQ300 and love all of those.

[Ole-Timer]

I received this in an email on 16 March 2018

Flex Innovations is requiring all Dual/A+B Diversity Spektrum Remote (Satellite) Receiver users take these actions before further flights:

Note: In order to always correctly detect Spektrum Remote A+B Diversity, additional logic was added to the Spektrum Remote processing code. If you see a flashing Red LED after updating to Firmware v1.6, this is an indication that you need to Re-Bind your Spektrum Remote Receivers.

- Update the Aura Config Tool (if needed to 1.1.5.0)
- Update to the latest firmware (1.6) which eliminates this potential Auto-Detect issue.
- Perform a fresh remote receiver BIND
- Perform a ‘new’ Auto-Detect -or- Use the Aura Config Tool to confirm/set A+B Diversity
- Perform a new Range Test per Spektrum guidelines.

This firmware update is also recommended to all Aura users to prevent any potential issues should dual satellites be used in the future.



Dec 2016
This is how I had my 170 set up Dual/A+B. During the 10th flight at our Club in front of several members I was really beginning to get a better feel for the airplane when at 20ft high it rolled uncontrollably right, spun twice and crashed nose first. It literally blew up..., a total loss that even ruined a 6s 8000mAh battery. The battery disconnected on impact. Both ailerons were still deflected full right and the rudder was just slightly left in spite of me inputting full left aileron and rudder well before it hit. When we plugged the remains back together everything worked normally...
I spoke with Quique twice and we emailed several times. I always believed there was an issue with the Aura but he assured me this could not be and I’m sure he believed I just screwed up and crashed it.
Being the nice guy he is, he offered me replacement wings, tail, and fuse at cost. The wings they sent looked like the first ones produced in a back room by a rookie. I’m now the proud owner of the most expensive junk 170 in the USA. It truly shameful as there was such a lack of overall reasonable quality.
I did not install the Aura and fly the 170 on Spektrum only, no gyro. Still a great flying plane but I will never buy another airplane from them.

After receiving the email on the update I returned one to them, reminding them of what had happened way back when...

Still no reply............

[78Sundancer]

I have both the carbon z cub and the 170 by flex. when I first got my 170 and flew it I really loved it but a friend got one and has had nothing but problems. Flex replaced it and he is still having troubles and now we get the email about the spectrum remote receiver. I have crashed mine and ordered a new one and it's ready to go but I have not flown it yet. I also have some other planes with the Aura 8 in them and I'm worried about flying them. On the other hand my carbon Z cub was one of the first issued and I have no issues with the flying on land or water

[xviper]

Dual/A+B.
After receiving the email on the update I returned one to them, reminding them of what had happened way back when...

Still no reply............

Can you give an example (or even show via a link) of a "dual/A+B" RX. I'm not sure I know what one is. I no longer buy Spektrum RXs and only use the ones that come with BNF planes. I use only Lemon RXs now but just curious if any of them are of this type.

That's one thing I've noticed about Flex and one of their sellers in Canada. They are very tardy when it comes to replying to customer questions. They may be smaller vendors and don't have the staff to allow quick responses but I can only compare with MotionRC. When I ask a question, no matter how insignificant, Motion responds within 1 business day. Companies that make their customers feel ignored, tend to stay small and have a hard time developing a broad customer base - attracting fewer new customers and losing some existing ones. When dealing with higher priced items that can be considered "specialty" products, can they afford to be like that?

[Ole-Timer]

For the Aura 8 you plugged two remote satellite receivers into the Aura unit then located the receivers in different locations within the airframe making sure to place the antenna in polarized positions. During the bind process one becomes the internal or A primary Rx and the second becomes the external or B secondary Rx. I no longer have a set up like this so I have no pictures.

Quique had told me that while the 170 manual supported this arrangement, it was not the favored one. He used a Futaba system and suggested I switch to that.

Spektrum details the use of these Rx’s at their website.

https://www.spektrumrc.com/Products/...ProdID=SPM9645

[xviper]

Thanks. I think I'll be OK. I don't use that type of receiver.

[Rosytime]

Well I have five Flex aircraft including the 170. Another club member had the Carbon Z cub and we flew them together. The Cessna will fly slower, outperform in climbing, and is more acrobatic especially if you download the extreme set-up which has the flaps working in unison with the ailerons. As far as the flight controllers in both, the AS3X is more intrusive while the Aura is not. I know from experience since I have had planes with the AS3X. As far as the comment of appearance, that's the least of my requirements. The plane just flies better than anything in it's class. Now if you just want to putt around the sky in a scale-like manner, by all means get the Carbon Z. I have never had a problem in getting good customer service from them. If I had a question I got a call back within a day. As far as the firmware problems, I fly Futaba and have never experienced any of those receiver problems. We wont get into the debate as to what system is better, but all the flex planes at my club have never had any of those firmware problems and almost all except me and two others use Spektrum.

[Mathursharad]

Oh hell. That makes me hesitate on the cap 232 I was thinking on now.

I have the cap 232. Overall the plane is very nice. I fly 3d and it does a great job.

500 is steep but for that you are getting a 60 size plane that can survive mishaps. Mine has already survived a pancake due to dislodged rudder servo arm.

However the landing gear is a little soft. I was surprised that a harrier plop landing bent the lower part of the gear inwards. I have tried to straighten it with a plier.

Secondly the wings had to be pushed in very hard to get them to line up with the screw holes in the fuselage. This is one of fit and finish issues Flex has

After a few flights this is not a problem. Wings go in first time without too much pressure now. I never had this issue with Horizon planes.

On the ground it seemed the servos are slow. But in the air I don't feel it. A person flying 3d for years will want faster servos. But for most amateur 3d pilots the stock servos suffice.

I use one standard spektrum RX. Aura is great. It seems to be way better than AS3X.

If you have the cash don't hesitate.

[rifleman_btx]

Cool, thanks for that, I was worried about how this was made after reading this thread

[bmoranx]

I have the Cessna 170 and Flexjet. The 170 flies great but the fit and finish of the 170 is horrible. Wings were hard to push in and the Phillips head screws heads were soft. Overspray, paint mis matches, especially the red, and touch ups on the canopy were all very visible. It does fly great but looks terrible.

The flex jet was a whole different story. Mine looks good out of the box, went together perfectly and flew wonderfully! Seems they need to get a handle on QC. For what you pay, this should NOT be happening...

[WorldsOldestKid]

Thanks for all the comments. I am new to the Airplane Hobby after many years of 1/4 scale Sprint cars back in the late 80's-90's. I currently have the Carbon Z Cessna and quite enjoy it although I use it as a trainer. Im anxious to learn some stunts and get more aggressive while bringing it home in one piece. I have been eyeing the 170 and found the feedback very helpful. The You Tube videos on the 170 look amazing in flight. One nice thing is I already own these expensive 6S batteries that could be used on both. My very first plane was the Apprentice 15. Somehow I let it get too far away and never saw it again Lol! The size of the Cessna is helpful with not so great eyesight :-)

[avalanchex]

I am also tossing up between 2 cessna's, the flex 170 and the carbon z 150 but I do have some notes on the Cap 232 and the aura 8.

I started out with the QQ Extra (using 1 spektrum Satellite), which I loved and have about 200+ flights with now, after a while I noticed the inputs felt a bit soggy? and occasionally would stick for about 1s, followed by a small heart attack because I was usually inverted, rolling, looping or a combination at the time. I updated and rebound the model and the issues seem to have resolved (20+ flights since then).

Also bought a Cap 232 after this which imo, is incredible, only change from stock I had to make was to up the elevator rates in mode 2. Had no control glitches, putting the wings on was stiff the first 2-3 times but is a breeze now. Only issue I had was I had a aileron servo horn drop from it's spindel in flight. I was very lucky as the screw didn't dislodge so landed with the floppy aileron, put it back on, checked all of the servos and tightened and it now has about 50+ flights and is my go to plane.

It's worth double checking everything on these planes as while they can be incredible, as some people have mentioned there can be some quality control issues.

[Whizzer]

Avalanchex, I have a Carbon X Cub that I bought four months ago. I am "in training" with an instructor but can give my impression of the plane. Before buying, I read reviews and seriously considered the FLEX 170. I went with the Carbon Z mainly because of the $100.00 price difference. A chap who started flying with me recently bought the FLEX 170 and we compare notes weekly. He recently broke a clevis pin and had difficulty finding another one because the size is different where it attaches to the threads on the control wire but lucky for him FLEX Is very close to the airfield where we fly. He mentioned he felt the parts were not as strong as they could/should be.

My observations, as a new-bee, the Cub Z is a very forgiving plane. It will do just about anything the 170 will do, but slightly slower as the motor is not as strong. The wind doesn't seem to adversely affect either plane and FWIW, they were both designed by the same guy, one of the principles of FLEX Innovations, and for all intent and purpose, they share many of the same design factors. On the Carbon Z, the landing gear seems weak and hard landings generally cause some damage such as the skirt coming off or bending the thin wire. That is until I bought 6" Dubrow inflated tires to soften landings than added a modification - using the Hanger9 Cub flexible landing gear - adapted to the Carbon Z and that finally seemed to make things right.
The Carbon Z pulls hard to the left on takeoff and seems sensitive to the touch for correction but once in the air is a very stable and solid airplane. My friend had difficulty with the landing gear on the 170 also and recently purchased a pair of 6" Dubrow inflated wheels to help absorb some of the shock. The 170 pulls also but most who fly it do not use much runway for takeoffs and are airborne within ten feet so it is not an issue with them. I notice torque pull and attention to correction because i like to use more runway and build speed slowly rather than simply go and perform a STOL maneuver.
I am using a 5200 Amh battery and get about ten minutes of flight time flying and learning but no radical or aerobatic stuff as I am a slow learner. My friend with the 170 has similar results and about the only real difference I can tell from discussing things with him is, his plane had more power and cost more. If you have any other specific questions, please do not hesitate to ask and if I don't know the answer, I'll check with my instructor and perhaps he will know. Like I said, I'm a slow learner but at my age it is similar to trying to teach an old dog new tricks. Hope this helps.

[Ole-Timer]

For sure double check everything on these planes and upgrade anything that looks sketchy. As with any models, that philosophy pays off in the end.
My Cessna 170 has no gyro, I removed the Aura 8 and fly with a Spektrum AR610 Rx. Having grown up without gyroscopes and the assorted transmitter accoutrements I’d identify the 170 as well designed airframe that does not need a gyro to fly. Full on 3D is a whole other topic and probably does require a gyro as this airframe strays from stunt plane design factors related to enhancing stability in that type. Due to its very light construction and ample power it outperforms all other airframes I have in this class. It’s a joy to fly and entertaining to the point that I regularly try to squeeze it into my truck whenever I can.