FW P-51 OldCrow

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         Had a great day of flying the Old Crow yesterday on the 3rd flight though landing was great but when I went to taxi back noticed the left side of the airplane was a little weird went out to retrieve it and found the gear had folded over.  Found the gear had come unglued but also found out that the gear had but 2 little spots of glue obviously not enough. Repaired the gear with a soft adhesive and seems to be OK. Almost felt like pulling the other side off but decided against it hope when it decides to come-off it will not cause any damage, this time the tank holder broke now I can't fly with tanks . kinda sucks!!!  wanted to add a little note this plane flies really nice installed the spektrum AR636 in her and it works great Thanks :(

[Lon]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

         Had a great day of flying the Old Crow yesterday on the 3rd flight though landing was great but when I went to taxi back noticed the left side of the airplane was a little weird went out to retrieve it and found the gear had folded over.  Found the gear had come unglued but also found out that the gear had but 2 little spots of glue obviously not enough. Repaired the gear with a soft adhesive and seems to be OK. Almost felt like pulling the other side off but decided against it hope when it decides to come-off it will not cause any damage, this time the tank holder broke now I can't fly with tanks . kinda sucks!!!  wanted to add a little note this plane flies really nice installed the spektrum AR636 in her and it works great Thanks :(

Have read claims of other people having the same issue with gear not glued in well from factory. I've got well over a hundred landings on my IronAss. Never had that issue. BUT...flying last week. Went to one of my places I fly, and summer soccer league has started...so, dang. where to fly that night, now. I knew of, and went to a low traveled hard top road.  With the wind direction, worked out great, until.  Did a great landing, wish they was all that way, BUT, after touching down, and starting to throttle back.  BOOM!! a very small pot hole, caught right wheel and boom, tore the landing gear out.  sigh

Lon

[Grossman56]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

Hey that's harsh Lon, finding a good field is bad enough, but the nerve of them to start playing soccer on it!?
Our flying field isn't the greatest, but I'm going to try it anyway.  Had the Waco and The Pandora up there and they were ok, time to try the Mustang out.  Picked up a spare set of retracts just in case.

Grossman56

[Rocketeer]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

Greetings Guy's,

Indeed, landing gear are the most common weak link within most great airplanes.

Having experienced exactly what you have with poorly glued in gear or gear that can't withstand impact, I have developed the habit of making the last step of any build process including gear and/or retracts, running a good bead of CA or Foam-Tac around the gear housings where the inserts meet the foam.

This has really helped greatly with giving a more robust bind between the gear and the wing.
Of course this is all moot if the darn things decide not to go in or out at all.

Such is the hobby of flying RC airplanes!!!

Clear Skies

Bill L.
in Okla.

[Lon]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

Hey that's harsh Lon, finding a good field is bad enough, but the nerve of them to start playing soccer on it!?
Our flying field isn't the greatest, but I'm going to try it anyway.  Had the Waco and The Pandora up there and they were ok, time to try the Mustang out.  Picked up a spare set of retracts just in case.

Grossman56

Gman,
yeh, imagine that....soccer leagues at a soccer field. The retract itself was not damaged, the all metal probably saved me there. The retract base itself just pulled out from the wing.  Took me all of 5 minutes to fix like new. Greased the landing and was just slowly throttling back, admiring the plane with the tail still up and letting it come down slowly.  Then SMACK!!! Caught that very little pothole...Geeee....

[Grossman56]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

Just got the landing gear reinforcements from Sean installed on Shangrila.  If you get a set, take a hammer and pound them flat as the drilled holes seemed to be raised.  Anyway, did that with mine so I'll see how they work out.  Also, I'm using aileron/rudder mix.  Got it set at -15% either way (Spektrum likes to use minus, don't know why....) and it really helps.  I know that we're comparing FMS to Freewing, but its worth a try, I just built it into a switch so I can turn it off if I have to, but its great so why would I?
So many Mustangs to fly and so little time, just hoping we got out of this rainy stretch.  Yeah, I know, a rainy stretch in Wyoming is usually 1/2 an hour, this has been for weeks with a few breaks,Christ, its even humid here, what's with that???!!!!!!
Hey you sound like me, greased a landing with the P51B and then pulled back on the elevator to settle the tail for taxi, oooppps!!! Forgot I still had 1/3 throttle, she bounced right back into the air, dang!

Grossman56

[starcop]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

Yeah, I've had my Iron Ass for over a year now with Zero problems; better knock on wood! I actually got mine from the pre-order days before I started working at Motion RC. It's been a fantastic flyer, one thing I did find was the strut stuck up. That was in one of my videos on youtube.com. I guess that's pretty darn good for longevity sake! Well, I wish you all great flights and smooth landings.

Matt in C/Service! Cheers! Thank you all for your continued support!

[Grossman56]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

Hey Starcrop, working for Motion!  Cool job.
Since your there, how about some advice!
My Fw P51 (used to be an Iron Ass model, converted to Old Crow) had not been in the air yet.  Had trouble with one retract, in that it wouldn't retract!  Had the wing back apart and checked out all the wiring, all was fine.  I put the retract on my servo tester and it would sporadically work.  I turned up the travel on it and it seemed to work okay.  Now, its back to nothing.  I was preflighting her and all excited to fly finally and now this.  So, I'm going to have to order another retract.  Now this plane was ordered on 03/19/15 order number 89966.
It hasn't been in the air yet all it's done is taxi tests.  Where do I stand warranty wise?

Grossman56

[Lon]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

I couldn't resist trying the FW Old Crow prop setup on my FW Iron Ass.  Received my order of prop and spinner last week. Was concerned with how the spinner did not fit tight like the stock 4 blade spinner. But decided to give it a try. Did two flights with the two blade setup. Performed well, but different of course. Let me sum it up, I've went back to my 4 blade with the prop mod. Plane is more responsive to throttle, specially during take off and vertical climb. And motor was warmer after 2 blade setup flight. Top end speed??? Would have to have a radar to determine. Note: these flights was with 5s.

[Lon]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

Yeah, I've had my Iron Ass for over a year now with Zero problems; better knock on wood! I actually got mine from the pre-order days before I started working at Motion RC. It's been a fantastic flyer, one thing I did find was the strut stuck up. That was in one of my videos on youtube.com. I guess that's pretty darn good for longevity sake! Well, I wish you all great flights and smooth landings.

Matt in C/Service! Cheers! Thank you all for your continued support!

Starcop,
I've had mine for over a year now too, and problem free. Haven't kept a log....but sitting here scratching my head..ummmm... I have to have well over 200 flights with my Iron Ass.

[ryramZ]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

Just got the landing gear reinforcements from Sean installed on Shangrila.  If you get a set, take a hammer and pound them flat as the drilled holes seemed to be raised.  Anyway, did that with mine so I'll see how they work out.  Also, I'm using aileron/rudder mix.  Got it set at -15% either way (Spektrum likes to use minus, don't know why....) and it really helps.  I know that we're comparing FMS to Freewing, but its worth a try, I just built it into a switch so I can turn it off if I have to, but its great so why would I?
So many Mustangs to fly and so little time, just hoping we got out of this rainy stretch.  Yeah, I know, a rainy stretch in Wyoming is usually 1/2 an hour, this has been for weeks with a few breaks,Christ, its even humid here, what's with that???!!!!!!
Hey you sound like me, greased a landing with the P51B and then pulled back on the elevator to settle the tail for taxi, oooppps!!! Forgot I still had 1/3 throttle, she bounced right back into the air, dang!

Grossman56

Let me play Devil's Advocate for a sec on mixes. First of all, good to leave yourself a way out. Next, let me play out a scenario from some observations I've made while flying. So, we pass the center of the field, it's time to turn, left, put the plane in a bank angle and pull through with elevator. If your seasoned you may even coordinate the turn with some rudder. Thing is, once your in the bank you aren't giving left aileron anymore anyway or you'd tuck under and spin her in. Many times you end up giving a little right aileron to keep from rolling in on the turn. With that being said if someone has the tendency to stay in the roll or bank too long with aileron input, it seems the rudder added by the mix would add to the potential problem. Or, since you're out of the roll the mix wouldn't be doing much anyway. 

I'm not anti mixes, but this one always comes up and my take is forget it. to each their own. I have done mixes though with flaps to negate a crazy nose up or down attitude when flaps were deployed. In most cases only on Horizon planes that call it out in the manual. Otherwise, it's up to me.

Kind regards,
Ryan

PS
Those going with the Old Crow two blade prop. The Old Crow motor is slightly larger and the ESC is an 80 rather than 60 AMP ESC so be careful. Iron ass can take the prop, it's the esc that should be upgraded.

[Grossman56]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

that's why its important to hit those neutrals. Bank with aileron, neutral and pull elevator.  Regardless of whether you have aileron rudder mix, if you hold in your aileron while pulling elevator, you are going to spin.  I've done it, that's how I lawn darted Pandora 2. with a symmetrical, you really don't need it but with a semi symmetrical or a flat bottom wing, It helps a lot.  Much more axial turns.  Besides, as you say, you throw a bit of rudder into your turns, I'm assuming you  take the rudder off at the same time you neutralize your ailerons.  That's what the A/R mix does.  When you get to symmetrical wings, you don't need to add rudder, so why learn something that you'll have to unlearn later? As you say, "If someone has the tendency to stay in the roll or bank too long with aileron input..." the problem isn't in the mix, the problem is they didn't return to neutral soon enough, if ever, they panic and pull back on the stick while never getting rid of the aileron input.
Don't mean to sound like I'm preaching here Ryan as I highly respect your flying abilities, each to their own, as you say.

Grossman56   

[ryramZ]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

My point is, if you neutralize the bank attitude, the rudder mix isn't doing anything anyway, the plane goes back into an uncoordinated slip, or neutral. And, Or if you counter the roll with opposite aileron because of too severe of a bank, then you end up inducing more drag on the airframe by increasing the slip angle because of the opposite rudder now present. I think we are saying the same thing, but different..lol Try it out. Let us know.

It's all a simultaneous action. Once you set the bank angle and relax you still need to fly the rudder to keep the plane at a 0 slip angle to be coordinated. All fun stuff. Funny part is these things all have enough power they can more often then not muscle through what would be bad situations in full scale.

Fair winds and following skies
Ryan

[Lon]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

Just got the landing gear reinforcements from Sean installed on Shangrila.  If you get a set, take a hammer and pound them flat as the drilled holes seemed to be raised.  Anyway, did that with mine so I'll see how they work out.  Also, I'm using aileron/rudder mix.  Got it set at -15% either way (Spektrum likes to use minus, don't know why....) and it really helps.  I know that we're comparing FMS to Freewing, but its worth a try, I just built it into a switch so I can turn it off if I have to, but its great so why would I?
So many Mustangs to fly and so little time, just hoping we got out of this rainy stretch.  Yeah, I know, a rainy stretch in Wyoming is usually 1/2 an hour, this has been for weeks with a few breaks,Christ, its even humid here, what's with that???!!!!!!
Hey you sound like me, greased a landing with the P51B and then pulled back on the elevator to settle the tail for taxi, oooppps!!! Forgot I still had 1/3 throttle, she bounced right back into the air, dang!

Grossman56

Let me play Devil's Advocate for a sec on mixes. First of all, good to leave yourself a way out. Next, let me play out a scenario from some observations I've made while flying. So, we pass the center of the field, it's time to turn, left, put the plane in a bank angle and pull through with elevator. If your seasoned you may even coordinate the turn with some rudder. Thing is, once your in the bank you aren't giving left aileron anymore anyway or you'd tuck under and spin her in. Many times you end up giving a little right aileron to keep from rolling in on the turn. With that being said if someone has the tendency to stay in the roll or bank too long with aileron input, it seems the rudder added by the mix would add to the potential problem. Or, since you're out of the roll the mix wouldn't be doing much anyway. 

I'm not anti mixes, but this one always comes up and my take is forget it. to each their own. I have done mixes though with flaps to negate a crazy nose up or down attitude when flaps were deployed. In most cases only on Horizon planes that call it out in the manual. Otherwise, it's up to me.

Kind regards,
Ryan

PS
Those going with the Old Crow two blade prop. The Old Crow motor is slightly larger and the ESC is an 80 rather than 60 AMP ESC so be careful. Iron ass can take the prop, it's the esc that should be upgraded.

I have a 85amp esc

[Grossman56]

RE: FW P-51 OldCrow

My point is, if you neutralize the bank attitude, the rudder mix isn't doing anything anyway, the plane goes back into an uncoordinated slip, or neutral. And, Or if you counter the roll with opposite aileron because of too severe of a bank, then you end up inducing more drag on the airframe by increasing the slip angle because of the opposite rudder now present. I think we are saying the same thing, but different..lol Try it out. Let us know.

It's all a simultaneous action. Once you set the bank angle and relax you still need to fly the rudder to keep the plane at a 0 slip angle to be coordinated. All fun stuff. Funny part is these things all have enough power they can more often then not muscle through what would be bad situations in full scale.

Fair winds and following skies
Ryan
Yes, you're probably  right.  With a Pandora, I mix the throw on the rudder to match the throw on the ailerons, bank neutral and pull elevator.  If she tends to climb, less elevator, if she tends to dive, more elevator.  With the FMS Mustangs, about half the throw on the rudder compared to the ailerons. Handles beautifully.  You can actually bank, return to neutral pause and the add elevator and lose very little if any altitude with the Pandoras.  Anyway, each to their own.  I have A3L's in all the Pandoras and Mustangs.  These combined with the Aileron/rudder mix are just beautiful to fly to me at least.  Of course, the way you would ultimately set any airplane up is to respond the way you want them to, to your personal inputs.  Everyone is different.  I've flown both types with and without the mix and without the A3L's, both are fine, I just prefer the way the handle with the mix.

Grossman56

[PilotAndy1994]

Was just looking up if anyone else had this issue and found this forum! I just got my HP Old Crow yesterday and was giddy to get her in the air this morning - and so i did! The first landing went without a hitch, and then on the second one she hit a little torsion with the crosswind and the left gear literally tore out and wrapped around the wing! Had to repair the plastic well cover where it tabs in the gear - now she is ready to flly again - but I am still suspicious about that other gear....Might just wait for it to go other than tearing it out....

Very surprised how little area is holding the gear in for a plane that can carry such a huge battery - I was running a 5000mah 4 cell in her at the time.

All in all a great steal for $219 Scratch and dent from motionrc.com....

HUGE plane...