600 UH-1N Twin Huey- ARF Bundle - Build and Impressions

[F106DeltaDart]

Okay, that is what I thought, still confused about the spacers, so your kit has the same parts as mine but yours came with wider spacers and bearing blocks? So on my kit conversion, all my spacers and bearing blocks were only 47" wide, I can't use the motors that are 49", now I got a problem trying to find a 1100 kv heli motor that will fit inside my frames. its like they made two different sets of spacers and bearing blocks.

Yes, my bearing blocks and spacers were around 10mm wider than the ESP, using those parts from the Chaos kit. Can you dremel out a bit more space in the frames to accommodate a larger motor? I’ve had to do that on a few smaller builds.

[DCORSAIR]

The Chaos 600 is a clone of the EFL, so I have the wider frames on mine than the ESP. I had some spacers (only a few) included with the initial kit, but most were missing. After contacting customer support, they ended up sending me a full spacer kit that worked excellent.

Okay, that is what I thought, still confused about the spacers, so your kit has the same parts as mine but yours came with wider spacers and bearing blocks? So on my kit conversion, all my spacers and bearing blocks were only 47" wide, I can't use the motors that are 49", now I got a problem trying to find a 1100 kv heli motor that will fit inside my frames. its like they made two different sets of spacers and bearing blocks.

[F106DeltaDart]

Ok, I am trying to figure out something here, I bought the Roban 212 fuselage and using a Trex 600ESP, everything fit perfect and all that, I need to change my motor to a lower KV and realized my frames are 47mm and all the Scorpion motors I need and most other 600 size motors are 49mm and wider, so how did you get that Scorpion 1100 to fit in your frames, you have the Chaos 600?? which has wider frames and you bought the ARF bundle, correct?? I have the same spacers and all that like yours but is yours a whole different set of wider spacers?? I thought we would have the same spacing but maybe not. I can't fit any motors over 47mm, I just found this out this morning when I went to order my motor. Thanks

The Chaos 600 is a clone of the EFL, so I have the wider frames on mine than the ESP. I had some spacers (only a few) included with the initial kit, but most were missing. After contacting customer support, they ended up sending me a full spacer kit that worked excellent.

[DCORSAIR]

Well, I did the maiden flight today and things could have gone better. First hover was fine. Rotor was smooth, just needed gain tuning. On the second attempt, I got to light on gear and heard a loud bang. The H stabs, and 3 of 4 doors simultaneously departed the aircraft. I immediately hit throttle cut. When the blades came to a stop, the windshield was cracked, pieces were laying around in the scale cockpit, and fiberglass around the swashplate was chewed up. The whole center console in the cockpit has broken loose (probably contains a 1/2lb of ballast or so), and the mechanics were loose on their mountings. My theory is that that either the rear ball link on the swashplate let go, or that one of the mounting bolts actually pulled through the aluminum L mounting brackets. Both the forward swash linkages were also bent inward, likely from contact with the fiberglass. The event also delaminated several sections of plywood where the mechanics bolt on. I can get it fixed, but it bugs me that I don’t have a definitive “smoking gun”.

Ok, I am trying to figure out something here, I bought the Roban 212 fuselage and using a Trex 600ESP, everything fit perfect and all that, I need to change my motor to a lower KV and realized my frames are 47mm and all the Scorpion motors I need and most other 600 size motors are 49mm and wider, so how did you get that Scorpion 1100 to fit in your frames, you have the Chaos 600?? which has wider frames and you bought the ARF bundle, correct?? I have the same spacers and all that like yours but is yours a whole different set of wider spacers?? I thought we would have the same spacing but maybe not. I can't fit any motors over 47mm, I just found this out this morning when I went to order my motor. Thanks

Might be time to do some cutting on my frames..............

[DCORSAIR]

I believe the spacers are for converting from the wider EFL or Pro versions of the Trex 600. If you used the ESP, you shouldn't need them. As for the umbrella gear, I moved to the bottom side after converting the one-way bearing for CCW rotation. Moving that umbrella gear keeps the tail rotating in the correct (and most efficient) direction when main gear rotation is reversed.

Oh, okay, thank you, I will leave mine as is, I don't care which way mine rotates, as long as it flies.....

[F106DeltaDart]

Hello sir, just about got my Bell 212 done, I have two round silver spacers left over, do yuo remember where these go?, they were with the two long silver spacers for the elevator servo spacers. Also noticed you had your secondary tail drive umbrella gear that drives the rear tail torque tube on the bottom side of the rear torque tube umbrella gear, I have mine on top, thank you.

I believe the spacers are for converting from the wider EFL or Pro versions of the Trex 600. If you used the ESP, you shouldn't need them. As for the umbrella gear, I moved to the bottom side after converting the one-way bearing for CCW rotation. Moving that umbrella gear keeps the tail rotating in the correct (and most efficient) direction when main gear rotation is reversed.

[DCORSAIR]

Thanks Alpha! Things have been pretty busy, so I am just getting to the mechanics again. First up was installing and shimming the metal gears for the torque tube. The kit includes some nicely machined metal gears to replace all of the bevel gears in the Chaos 600. For the tail pickup, I did change the gear arrangement up a bit. If you are sticking with stock (CW) rotor rotation, the following will not need to be changed, and can be ignored. However, I wanted CCW scale rotation on the main rotor. So, I pressed out the one-way bearing with an arbor press, and pressed it back in upside-down. However this also reverses your tail rotor direction. For highest efficiency (and scale) the innermost tail rotor blade should always rotate up, into the rotor wash. To make this happen I had to move the tail bevel gear from its stock position (above tail output bevel gear) to below the bevel gear. This was easily done by extending the flat spot on the shaft using a dremel cutting wheel.

The gear positions were then adjusted using the included shims. Gear mesh should be tight, with just a bit of backlash between the 2 bevel gears. The gears were the lubricated with synthetic grease. All metal to metal joints will require lubrication to reduce wear. Another item of note to those building this kit, is that sets of specs are included. The Chaos mechanics are wider than the Trex 600 ESP it was designed for, but the spacers allow them to be stretched to the larger size. These are the blocks shown on the inboard side of the tail shaft bearing blocks in my photos. Also of note, is that the builder will need to secure the bearings inside the tail bearing blocks with a retaining compound. Otherwise they are just floating in the blocks, and can easily be knocked out.

Finally, for the main shaft, the kit includes 2 sets of bearing blocks, but the frames have provisions for a third below the main shaft. Even though the stock 2 should be more than adequate for scale flying, I elected to add a third using Trex 600 spare parts: http://www.aligntrexstore.com/Bearin...1-_p_1556.html. More to come soon.

Hello sir, just about got my Bell 212 done, I have two little round silver spacers left over, do you remember where these go?, they were with the two long silver spacers for the elevator servo. Also noticed you had your secondary tail drive umbrella gear that drives the rear tail torque tube was on the bottom side of the rear torque tube umbrella gear, I have mine on top, just curious if this matters.

[DCORSAIR]

I just had the stock bracing configuration, with the tray supported by the lift frame forward of the cabin, the aft cabin wall, and the epoxy seam around the edge. It's definitely possible that some reinforcements could be enough to shift the natural frequency. But by the time I figured out were the issue was, I had destroyed the stock tray beyond repair. May be worth doing in future models just for the peace of mind.

Yeah, I see the thin plywood on mine as well where the blind nuts are located, I will do some reinforcements around those areas, I don't think I will do a complete new floor, just some bracing along the side of the side frames of the trex 600 and across the back then from the top of the mechanics down to the floor as well.
My plans are not to keep this one anyway, I think I want all 700-800 size now that I have the Roban 800 AH-6 Little Bird, I want the 800 UH-1N and the 700 Cobra.

[F106DeltaDart]

Do you have any braces from the top area of the frame over to the fuselage, this really seems to firm it up.

I just had the stock bracing configuration, with the tray supported by the lift frame forward of the cabin, the aft cabin wall, and the epoxy seam around the edge. It's definitely possible that some reinforcements could be enough to shift the natural frequency. But by the time I figured out were the issue was, I had destroyed the stock tray beyond repair. May be worth doing in future models just for the peace of mind.

[TiredIronGRB]

Do you have any braces from the top area of the frame over to the fuselage, this really seems to firm it up.

[F106DeltaDart]

Wow, looks awesome and glad you got it going, what was the main issue with it anyway or did you find out it was a mounting issue causing the vibes??

Glad you got that 800 size Medic 222 heli over on RCG, that was a great deal.

Thanks! My best guess at this point, is that it was a resonance with the upper mounting tray. After switching to 1/4” ply, the tray was much more rigid, and the fuselage has no noticeable vibration. The 222 was a great deal for sure! It might be a while before I get to it though, starting to build up a long heli backlog. On the bench now, I have a 500 H-34 Choctaw, 600 OH-58A, 500 OH-58D Kiowa, 700 AH-1W Super Cobra, 600 size Bell 222 (4 blade 680 rotor demonstrator), 450 UH-1B, and a 450 A-109! I’ll be busy a while!

[DCORSAIR]

Finally got the UH-1N in the air this evening with the doors, cowlings, and full cockpit installed. I love how it looks and flys! Will be adding the crew in the back next, as well as attaching the crew doors, and adding the stab bar on the rotor head.

Wow, looks awesome and glad you got it going, what was the main issue with it anyway or did you find out it was a mounting issue causing the vibes??

Glad you got that 800 size Medic 222 heli over on RCG, that was a great deal.

[F106DeltaDart]

Finally got the UH-1N in the air this evening with the doors, cowlings, and full cockpit installed. I love how it looks and flys! Will be adding the crew in the back next, as well as attaching the crew doors, and adding the stab bar on the rotor head.

[Heli143]

That was definitely a good looking fleet!
And please everyone posts as many pics and videos as you'd like... scale fanatics love to look at pics and watch videos of helis

[DCORSAIR]

No problem! Always enjoy seeing more scale helis! You have quite the impressive fleet. I just put the 2nd flight on the Huey after the rebuild. After I got used to how it feels, it flew quite nicely. Next flight will have the cowling and doors back on!

Thank you but I sold all those and got into EDF jets because I had a nice long runway right across the street from my house to fly the jets, got as little burned out on the scale helis, that was a lot of work and maintenance, I wish I would have kept them now because I am losing my runway, so I'm just getting back into scale helis again. Hope yours stays together this time, that is a nice Huey.

[F106DeltaDart]

Here is the G-Jive video and I hope you don't mind me posting these pics and videos here, I just realized this was your post about the Huey build.

https://youtu.be/34EMU7pAgKM

No problem! Always enjoy seeing more scale helis! You have quite the impressive fleet. I just put the 2nd flight on the Huey after the rebuild. After I got used to how it feels, it flew quite nicely. Next flight will have the cowling and doors back on!

[DCORSAIR]

Here is the G-Jive video and I hope you don't mind me posting these pics and videos here, I just realized this was your post about the Huey build.

https://youtu.be/34EMU7pAgKM

[DCORSAIR]

Here is one of my Funkey MD Hughes 500 that was a nightmare to get the vibes out, this was my last flight with it and I finally accomplished it and then I sold it, the second video is the Roban Hughes 500E G-Jive, it was good right from the start, it just doesn't make sense why some fuselages have vibes and some don't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MALgRiZWz4

[DCORSAIR]

The frames are wider, but spacers are included with the kit to make it work. Initially, my kit was missing a few of these, but Motion was able to send me an extra spacer set within the week. The frames for the ESP should be an easier fit though! Will try to get some video soon. Also, I recommend looking at some of the replies to my thread over on scalerchelis: https://www.scalerchelis.com/phpBB2/...19587&f=17, it would seem I’m not the only one who has had resonance issues. You might consider adding another layer of 1/8” ply under the main mounting tray. The stiffer tray seems to have alleviated the issues in my case. Good luck on the build!

Thank you for the info. I am aware of these vibes that your talking about, I have built six 600 size Hughes 500D and E models, all had vibes, some I never solved, also built two 600 size Agusta 109 that never gave me any trouble, no vibes at all, built one AS- 350, it would vibrate a little on spool down only and none whats so ever when spooling up or flying, also did a Thunder Tiger AS-355 when they were available and it was also smooth as silk, so the only ones that gave me the most headaches were the Hughes 500 fuselages, so I am not looking forward to getting this one going and having to deal with all those vibes, maybe I will get lucky and no vibes.............

Here are just a few I have built in the last five years or so. First pics shows my Thunder Tiger Raptor .50 converted to a Schweizer 300, Centruy Bell 47, Funkey Agusta 109, Thunder Tiger AS-355 and a Funkey AS-350, second pic shows a Roban Magnum PI Hughes 500D, Roban G-Jive Hughes 500E and a Funkey Sheriff Hughes 500E, 3rd pic is a Roban Hughes 500E Black Ops, and the last pic was my Funkey Jet Ranger, the rest I can't seem to find pictures.

[F106DeltaDart]

Glad to see you might have it figured out, get some video when you can.
I have some Trex 600 ESP mechanics coming next week for mine, I didn't go with the Chaos 600 FBL.pro mechanics, I thought they had wider frames than the Trex 600?
Did you have any problems with yours?

The frames are wider, but spacers are included with the kit to make it work. Initially, my kit was missing a few of these, but Motion was able to send me an extra spacer set within the week. The frames for the ESP should be an easier fit though! Will try to get some video soon. Also, I recommend looking at some of the replies to my thread over on scalerchelis: https://www.scalerchelis.com/phpBB2/...p?t=19587&f=17, it would seem I’m not the only one who has had resonance issues. You might consider adding another layer of 1/8” ply under the main mounting tray. The stiffer tray seems to have alleviated the issues in my case. Good luck on the build!