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  • #21
    Originally posted by VOODOO View Post

    Not trying to be critical, but the B52 was not in any way a scaled up B47. Firstly, the B47 was a much earlier design from Lockheed, while the B52 came off Boeing's drawing boards. One failing of the B47 was that operated very close to it's "coffin corner" between a high speed stall and it's low speed stall, making it like flying on a tightrope, similar to the U2 at it's extreme altitude limits.
    What was the Lockheed designation? I know that Martin did the XB-48 which was a straight-wing with the engines in a box. And I still contend that the B-52 was ultimately derived from the B-47 right down to the two prototypes having the "fighter" style tandem cockpit. Here's what Wikipedia says:

    On Thursday, 21 October 1948, Boeing engineers George S. Schairer, Art Carlsen and Vaughn Blumenthal presented the design of a four-engine turboprop bomber to the chief of bomber development, Colonel Pete Warden. Warden was disappointed by the projected aircraft and asked if the Boeing team could come up with a proposal for a four-engine turbojet bomber. Joined by Ed Wells, Boeing vice president of engineering, the engineers worked that night in The Hotel Van Cleve in Dayton, Ohio, redesigning Boeing's proposal as a four-engine turbojet bomber. On Friday, Colonel Warden looked over the information and asked for a better design. Returning to the hotel, the Boeing team was joined by Bob Withington and Maynard Pennell, two top Boeing engineers who were in town on other business.[41]

    By late Friday night, they had laid out what was essentially a new airplane. The new design (464–49) built upon the basic layout of the B-47 Stratojet with 35-degree swept wings, eight engines paired in four underwing pods, and bicycle landing gear with wingtip outrigger wheels.[42] A notable feature of the landing gear was the ability to pivot the main landing gear up to 20° from the aircraft centerline to increase safety during crosswind landings.[43] After a trip to a hobby shop for supplies, Schairer set to work building a model. The rest of the team focused on weight and performance data. Wells, who was also a skilled artist, completed the aircraft drawings. On Sunday, a stenographer was hired to type a clean copy of the proposal. On Monday, Schairer presented Colonel Warden with a neatly bound 33-page proposal and a 14-inch scale model.[41] The aircraft was projected to exceed all design specifications.[44]

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    • #22
      Originally posted by Valkpilot View Post

      What was the Lockheed designation? I know that Martin did the XB-48 which was a straight-wing with the engines in a box. And I still contend that the B-52 was ultimately derived from the B-47 right down to the two prototypes having the "fighter" style tandem cockpit. Here's what Wikipedia says:

      On Thursday, 21 October 1948, Boeing engineers George S. Schairer, Art Carlsen and Vaughn Blumenthal presented the design of a four-engine turboprop bomber to the chief of bomber development, Colonel Pete Warden. Warden was disappointed by the projected aircraft and asked if the Boeing team could come up with a proposal for a four-engine turbojet bomber. Joined by Ed Wells, Boeing vice president of engineering, the engineers worked that night in The Hotel Van Cleve in Dayton, Ohio, redesigning Boeing's proposal as a four-engine turbojet bomber. On Friday, Colonel Warden looked over the information and asked for a better design. Returning to the hotel, the Boeing team was joined by Bob Withington and Maynard Pennell, two top Boeing engineers who were in town on other business.[41]

      By late Friday night, they had laid out what was essentially a new airplane. The new design (464–49) built upon the basic layout of the B-47 Stratojet with 35-degree swept wings, eight engines paired in four underwing pods, and bicycle landing gear with wingtip outrigger wheels.[42] A notable feature of the landing gear was the ability to pivot the main landing gear up to 20° from the aircraft centerline to increase safety during crosswind landings.[43] After a trip to a hobby shop for supplies, Schairer set to work building a model. The rest of the team focused on weight and performance data. Wells, who was also a skilled artist, completed the aircraft drawings. On Sunday, a stenographer was hired to type a clean copy of the proposal. On Monday, Schairer presented Colonel Warden with a neatly bound 33-page proposal and a 14-inch scale model.[41] The aircraft was projected to exceed all design specifications.[44]
      You are correct that Boeing originated the B47 design, but I grew up in Atlanta, not far from Lockheed's Marietta plant and all the locals called the B47 Lockheed because they were built locally under license and designated Lockheed B47s. I watched them fly around the area for years, sometimes towing a huge drag chute behind. Over 300 were built by Lockheed. I do still maintain that the B52 was actually a new design, not a derivative of the B47, just as the Douglas DC8 was not a derivative of the 707, although both had similar configurations.

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      • #23
        Whatever Lockheed's designation was, I guarantee it wasn't the nickname given the B-52 by its crews - BUFF. :)

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        • #24
          The astounding thing is that the B52 was given this nickname before any of the crews flying it today were even born!

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          • #25
            Originally posted by VOODOO View Post
            The astounding thing is that the B52 was given this nickname before any of the crews flying it today were even born!
            Speaking of the BUFF's age:
            Daily updates of everything that you need know about what is going on in the military community and abroad including military gear and equipment, breaking news, international news and more.

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            • #26
              Originally posted by VOODOO View Post
              The astounding thing is that the B52 was given this nickname before any of the crews flying it today were even born!
              My Dad worked on BUFFs before I was born.

              And, if the USAF sticks to the schedule they've been discussing, BUFFs will still be flying when my kids reach my age.

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