painting a foam warbird

[Grossman56]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXSSPvyPfVs
Hey guys and gals, I found this series of videos very helpful, check them out

Grossman56

[Konrad]

RE: painting a foam warbird

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXSSPvyPfVs
Hey guys and gals, I found this series of videos very helpful, check them out

Grossman56

I find a product called "Goof Off" to work much better than acetone at stripping paint off of EPO foam.
http://www.goofoffproducts.com

With Goof Off the paint often peals off in sheets by using a unidirectional rub . This often leaves little or no "staining" of the foam bead interfaces, unlike acetone.

I don't like the Hobbico spackle product as it cost way too muck.

I use Red Devil one time light weight spackling
http://www.reddevil.com/index.php?l=product_list&c=345#.Vj6eO9aaLzI

You can add food coloring if you want. But as the base color of the foam is white I don't see the need. Coloring just means I have to add more paint for good coverage.

[Grossman56]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Here's an update on Pandora two's new paint scheme in progress.
So far so good
Scalloped wing colors are monocoat strips from MotionR/C, cut by hand and laid over the yellow paint.  Bottom and top scallops are one piece

Just getting up the nerve to get the other wing done.  Not hard really, just time consuming.  Then its on to the tail!

Grossman56

[CT]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Here's an update on Pandora two's new paint scheme in progress.
So far so good
Scalloped wing colors are monocoat strips from MotionR/C, cut by hand and laid over the yellow paint.  Bottom and top scallops are one piece

Just getting up the nerve to get the other wing done.  Not hard really, just time consuming.  Then its on to the tail!

Grossman56

Very sweet looking Gman. Some of these projects can really get out of hand, before you know it you have many hours invested, but thats the fun with this hobby.
PS  - My wife would think differently

Chris

[Grossman56]

RE: painting a foam warbird

I hear you!  So far its cost me about $12, so I'm coming in under budget!

So here she is in the complete upper color scheme.  Still have to do some touch ups from the tape peeling paint.  I'll have to spray a little paint into a cup and brush it on I guess.  The bottom of the plane isn't done yet and I had a little fubar so one set of Scallops is a little longer than the other on the bottom, oh well, live and learn.  I'm thinking of using Alabama State U's icon for the sides. 

I'll get some decal material and print my own, just 'cause I haven't done that before!
Pandoras seem to be the perfect plane for learning to paint, does anyone keep there's stock any more?

Grossman56

[Lon]

RE: painting a foam warbird



yes...who hasn't done some modifications......
 

[Grossman56]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Here's another update!  All the decals are on and since these pics, I've began to do some touch ups as well.

Just waiting for the decal sheets to come to make the Hornet for the sides, she'll look pretty good when she's done!

Grossman56

[Alpha]

RE: painting a foam warbird

That looks excellent! I would have never thought it was a Pandora unless I studied it long and hard.

[Grossman56]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Thanks Alpha1
The yellow is a spray bomb, so Minwax doesn't work on it, being water based.  Has anyone tried the oil based Varathane on foam?

I'm thinking it should work just fine.

Grossman56

[OV10]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Gman,
Venture carefully with the oil based products on foam. The various thanes like meth, triclor, etc which are usually in the oil bases tend not to play friendly with foam.

[doctormike]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Nice job!, Grossman. I used spray paint on my Tiger Moth (seen under
"tips and tricks") and then, after completely dry, brushed on Varathane water based clear coat. It really made the paint look nice and glossy and adhered very well. I suppose oil based clear coat would work. Let us know the results if you try it. Doc

[Konrad]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Gman,
Venture carefully with the oil based products on foam. The various thanes like meth, triclor, etc which are usually in the oil bases tend not to play friendly with foam.

Yes test first! 

With polystyrene many solvents will attack it. Now with polypropylene (EPO) most "household/garage" solvents won't touch it.
That is in fact a problem with painting EPO almost nothing will etch it to allow paints to adhere to the normally waxy surface. 
So if you are aware of anything that will etch (attack) EPO in modern paint formulations please let us know. 

I'm sick and tiered of my 2 week old models looking like they are a decade old and ratty.

All the best,
Konrad 

[doctormike]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Hi, Konrad. From my experience, about the best one can do is wipe it down with alcohol, LIGHTLY sand with 900 grit wet-dry paper, wipe again with alcohol, spray paint with Rustoleum, let COMPLETELY dry, and brush on 2 coats of Varathane water base clear coat, which for me, adheres very well. This gives a beautiful, fairly tough finish. This has worked well for me, however, foam is foam! Good luck, Doc

[Konrad]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Sanding teeth into the surface is a very good idea. But with the molding surface (vent holes) and assembly alignment issues I find this to be very time consuming. And if you break through the bead's skin the finish is just horrible. I assume you are using the alcohol as a degreaser to remove any oils from your skin.

I'v had less than stellar results using rattle can Rust-oleum "Painter's touch 2X", and Krylon "Color Master" Acrylic.  Now I know these brands have various formulations  and these formulation have changed over time.

Not sure what WBPU has to do with adhesion. The thick brushed on coats may help with the "glass" look as it might fill in the bead part lines. I'm not aware of WBPU curing into a hard surface (unlike an epoxy top coat).

I've yet to find a hardware paint and process that will allow one to mask without the base paint lifting. As to masking I've found that Frog tape for delicate surfaces works about 80% of the time, if one uses a hair drier to heat up (loosen) the tape's adhesive as one tries to remove it.

As I've said painting EPO is a bear of a chore and one that the OEM's have not mastered!

Here is what I'm dealing with and what I hope to accomplish with my war bird.

All the best,
Konrad

[doctormike]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Hi, Konrad. 900 grit wet dry will not break through the skin if used judiciously. Alcohol helps remove the mold release. As far as time consuming goes... I'm like a bulldog when it comes to experimenting untill I get it right. I'm retired... what else am I doing? This is about 70% of my enjoyment of this hobby. All I can say is, Ive had excellent results from the above technique. As far as masking goes... real problem. Almost anything will pull paint off the foam. I've had fair results by cutting my masking from printing paper and using adjustable stick glue. Trouble is.. it tends to not stay in place, and if you put it on too thick, it will pull off some paint. When you're done you have to touch up. As Grossman suggested, I spray paint into a cup and use a throw away brush to touch up. Look at my Tiger Moth paint job under "tips and tricks". Doc

[Konrad]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Hi, Konrad. 900 grit wet dry will not break through the skin if used judiciously. Alcohol helps remove the mold release. As far as time consuming goes... I'm like a bulldog when it comes to experimenting untill I get it right. I'm retired... what else am I doing? This is about 70% of my enjoyment of this hobby. All I can say is, Ive had excellent results from the above technique. As far as masking goes... real problem. Almost anything will pull paint off the foam. I've had fair results by cutting my masking from printing paper and using adjustable stick glue. Trouble is.. it tends to not stay in place, and if you put it on too thick, it will pull off some paint. When you're done you have to touch up. As Grossman suggested, I spray paint into a cup and use a throw away brush to touch up. Look at my Tiger Moth paint job under "tips and tricks". Doc

Wasn't aware that there was a need for mold release with molding polypropylene, I'd have thought the waxy surface was sufficient  So is the release agent soluble in alcohol (ethanol, methanol or isopropanol). If not aren't we just imbedding it deeper into the foam when sanding? Anybody have more on this, release agent and their solubility?


On the subject of sanding I find that grades finer than 600 are counter productive. On soft materials like EPO the material just flexes (moves) away from the abrasive. Also in my frustration I tend to use too much pressure and windup embossing the paper (sanding block) into the foam. I like 400 grit as it will knock down the vent bumps with a bit of patience and still cut through, in a reasonable time, the EPO gloss to give the paint some purchase. I recall only using 900- 1200 grit to knock down the paint high spots in clear lacquer top coats prior to buffing. 


Have a link to "adjustable stick glue"?


All the best,
Konrad

[doctormike]

RE: painting a foam warbird

No link. You can buy it at Walmart or any office supply.

[Grossman56]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Hi Guys!
It's the ageless question isn't it?  How do you mask without pulling the paint up.
I use the Frog Tape for delicate surfaces and like Konrad says, its good maybe 80% of the time.  I always lay it on my shirt a few times to get the tack down to minimum as well.  Now the heat idea is something I haven't tried so I'll keep that in mind.
Also, don't press anything down except the edge you're using, the less that is stuck down firmly, the better chance of not pulling paint, you can also clear coat the edge first with Minwax or Varathane to ensure a good line
Interestingly, I had no trouble masking the Freewing Mustang and have noticed that the factory paint sticks far better than what we are applying.
Also, as I've stated before, with a raw foam surface, such as a new Pandora, I've used a rag and some Minwax and scrubbed the surface first.  As the mold release is oil based and the Minwax is water based, it raises the oil up and you wipe it off, works great!
I used Rust-oleum Painters Touch 2x Ultra Cover Paint and+Primer.
It does a nice job but it still lifts when taped unless you're very careful and it would seem to be oil based so when I tried to Varathane it with the water based Varathane, it beaded up.  All fine and dandy, I used the Varathane over the black tips and the nose, which were coated with a water based acrylic.
I had some semi gloss oil based Varathane that I tried on a spare piece of foam and it didn't harm it so I'm thinking that the gloss should be okay, have to pick up a can.

Put the Hornet decals on her yesterday and learned a few things about making decals.  They are not water proof right out of the printer, you have to coast them with something.  In my case, I used a workable fixative that I use for my pencil drawings and that had pretty good results.  I ordered Papilio  decal sheets off Amazon.  They recommend using a decal fixative, so order that as well if you're going that route (try www.papilio.com, that's their website)
The other thing that I think would have given me better results is to have converted the picture to black and white as its only black, white and yellow, this would have allowed it to blend in with the yellow base better, but hey, its a learning experience!
What I would love to find is a set of wheel pants for her, that would really set it off, any ideas?

Grossman56

[Alpha]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Depending on what type of pattern you're trying to mask, instead of painter's tape I use wet newspaper. It doesn't pull up the existing paint, and leaves a semi-hard edge. Great for camouflage patterns, especially.

[Konrad]

RE: painting a foam warbird

Depending on what type of pattern you're trying to mask, instead of painter's tape I use wet newspaper. It doesn't pull up the existing paint, and leaves a semi-hard edge. Great for camouflage patterns, especially.

How are you keeping the latex or acrylic from bleeding under, wick/capillary action, of the water (wet newspaper)? Any issue with the transfer of newsprint ink?