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MCB-E ("blue box") Issues, Post up your experiences

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  • MCB-E ("blue box") Issues, Post up your experiences

    ATTENTION!! This is not a "bash FW or MRC" thread! This thread is for pilots to report issues with the MCB-E on their new planes ONLY!

    So after getting the new F/A-18C and not having an issue with the MCB-E like I did with the L-39 and F-22, I decided to do an experiment as the F-18 got a Graupner RX versus the XPS RXs I was using in the other two. I found that swapping out the XPS RX in the F-22 for a Graupner RX solved my issue with that bird.

    Since so many people are having issues with the Multi-function Control Box E (MCB-E), I thought I'd start a thread for everyone to post up their specific issues with it, and what you did to solve them, if anything. Maybe with enough information Freewing and Motion can figure out what specifically to look at for a fix. If they keep putting the MCB-E in new releases without any changes, there will be a lot of unhappy folks when they get their new plane and it doesn't work right or causes a crash on maiden. I hope that this thread can assist FW and MRC with improving the quality of the MCB-E.

    So here's what I'm asking everyone to do. If you have or have had issues with control surfaces acting crazy when you have everything hooked into the MCB-E, post up all of the details you can regarding the issue, including any changes to the power system from stock, what brand and type of RX, etc. See my examples below.

    To date, the MCB-E has been included in the following planes:

    L-39 80mm
    F-22 90mm
    F/A-18C 90mm

    I have had all 3, so here's what I've observed.


    L-39
    First pre-order, all stock, everything hooked to the MCB-E
    XPS Nano2 end-pin 6-ch RX
    JR XP9303 converted to 2.4GHz using the XPS radio module

    Upon initially hooking everything up stock to my RX, the rudder and nose steering stopped working when the landing gear was deployed. When the gear was retracted, the rudder worked fine (and the nose steering was disabled as normal). Nothing I did solved the issue until I unplugged the rudder and nose steering from the MCB-E and put them on a Y-harness direct to the RX. After that, everything worked fine and I had no issues for the time I had the plane (20+ flights). I had originally submitted a ticket with MRC for a replacement MCB-E. When it finally came in I installed it in stock form and once again had the rudder issue. Original was sent back to MRC, and they said it worked fine in testing.


    F-22
    First pre-order, all stock, everything hooked to the MCB-E
    XPS Nano2 end-pin 6-ch RX with the X10 channel expander
    JR XP9303 converted to 2.4GHz using the XPS radio module

    Upon initially hooking everything up stock to my RX, the rudder and nose steering stopped working when the landing gear was deployed, and both rudder servos and the steering servo would chatter and deflect the rudders up to 8mm. When the gear was retracted, the rudders worked fine (and the nose steering was disabled as normal). Nothing I did solved the issue until I unplugged the rudders and nose steering from the MCB-E and put them on a tri-harness (used for landing gear) direct to the RX. After that, everything worked fine and I had no issues from then on. Eventually I converted the power system from stock 6S to a JF90 12S system with a Castle CC20 Pro BEC. I never tried putting everything back stock on the MCB-E and just left the rudders and steering Y'd direct to the RX.

    Today I made two flights with the F-22 still using XPS and rudders/steering removed from the MCB-E. I recently bought a Graupner Mz-24 and have been slowly converting all my planes over. So I decided to do that with the F-22 today after returning home from the field. But first I wanted to see if I still had the same issues as I had not tried it with the new power system. Hooked everything back up to the MCB-E, and the gremlins returned. So I pulled out the XPS RX and put in a Graupner GR-16L with everything hooked to the MCB-E, and now it works fine.


    F/A-18C
    First pre-order, all stock, everything hooked to the MCB-E
    Graupner GR-16L RX
    Graupner Mz-24

    Everything worked correctly out of the box, no issues. Maiden flight plus one today, no issues.
    Pat

  • #2
    So I just put a volt meter on both the XPS and Graupner RXs. Both are reading 5v dead on for output. So maybe this is not a voltage issue, but something else? If so, I'm at a loss to make a guess as to what it could be.
    Pat

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by crxmanpat View Post
      So I just put a volt meter on both the XPS and Graupner RXs. Both are reading 5v dead on for output. So maybe this is not a voltage issue, but something else? If so, I'm at a loss to make a guess as to what it could be.
      I was going to post that I recall the issue was with some systems running 6v and the box only working at 5v, but I see you have that covered. I presume that you are not running with a LiFe receiver battery?

      Comment


      • #4
        In the F-22 I have a Castle CC20 Pro, and in the F-18 I'm using the stock BEC. No separate power to the RX.
        Pat

        Comment


        • #5
          In the process of tearing down my fuselage to salvage parts for the replacement, I discovered that the battery wires were actually routed through one of the sets of wires for the integrated/combined connectors to the wings. If they happened to separate cables to the same channels, i.e. the three wires to each servo, Faraday's law might cause some funky things to happen when you abruptly change throttle power, thus total current through the battery wires (changing magnetic flux), such as unmatched electromotive forces, including the ground.

          Might explain some of the malfunctions experienced when punching to full throttle.

          Comment


          • #6
            Thanks for making this thread, Pat. Please keep posting, guys. The only thing I'd continue to emphasize is that, in addition to discussing it here among ourselves as peers, please also contact the official Motion RC CS Support Team so they can document all of these. I know some of you have already done so, and we've been collecting feedback for the MFCB since its release, as we do with all products. Trust your input will be added to the greater whole.

            Whether it's something theoretical such as Fredmdbud's observation of wires, or something tangible such as "here's a photo of two conjoined solder pads creating a short circuit", our attitude is that any and every bit of information is helpful to establish patterns and outliers. We can then take that information and as needed supplement our own in-factory testing schema, perhaps accurize the manual so it's more clear, and also help rule out any other "issues" that turn out not to be.

            I'll also publish some of our testing data for the MFCB throughout the year and thousands of test hours the engineering team worked on it. Hopefully that will help shed some light on what some of you are seeing and rule out other potential causes.

            It may be helpful to standardize your posts by including which radio and receiver you used, and also if you used the stock setup or used an alternative UBEC or Rx pack.

            Thanks all.
            Live Q&A every Tuesday and Friday at 9pm EST on my Twitch Livestream

            Live chat with me and other RC Nuts on my Discord

            Camp my Instagram @Alpha.Makes

            Comment


            • #7
              I was told by a motion tech. rep. not to use Spectrum 8000 or 9000 series receivers on my F22.
              Does this also apply to the F18?
              Why is it so?
              Why doesn't the manual say anything about it?
              Is it also true for Hobby King and Lemon DSMX receivers?
              Alpha, please explain.

              Comment


              • #8
                Flew my F-22 today after switching out the XPS RX for a Graupner, everything hooked to the blue box in stock configuration, and had no issues whatsoever.
                Pat

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by clearprop88 View Post
                  I was told by a motion tech. rep. not to use Spectrum 8000 or 9000 series receivers on my F22.
                  Does this also apply to the F18?
                  Why is it so?
                  Why doesn't the manual say anything about it?
                  Is it also true for Hobby King and Lemon DSMX receivers?
                  Alpha, please explain.
                  I think this applies to any plane with the MCB-E, including the F-18, F-22 and L-39.
                  Pat

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I've have the F-22 8 cell version. Initially had no problems, but after a handful of flights, nose steering died, and ended up using y to rudder. Motion sent another box, and I flew it approx 15 or more flights no issues, until one day after initial flight went to connect new batts and heard pop. I have no idea what happened, but every servo except the two main gears, died. no smoke, burnt smell or any indication of short could be found. Motor worked fine. Sent box and esc/bec into motion, was checked and found OK/returned. In meantime purchased another f22 minus motor and esc, and have approx 6 to 9 flights, no issues. Needless to say this was a very expensive mystery. Still flying F22, the best jet ever IMO and also acquired L-39 camo which i've flown a couple of times.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      So the Gremlin Box fun continues.. I’ve bypassed all the Control surfaces to Y’s & left the Retracts & leds on the Box .. What else is there to go wrong?? Well.. When gear Retracts the Strobe light on top fuse goes off & the landing lights stay on inside the Fuse.. If I disconnect the battery it will return to normal function but intermittently will go back to Gremlin form after a few more Retract tests.. Very frustrating to the point I will totally put this BB in the trash bin & replace with a V2 light sequencer.. At least I know it’s reliable..I fly with Lemon Stabs on all my Planes..

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I am flying all the birds in question using Admiral Rx's and Spektrum DX9 radio. I am reporting zero issues.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by crxmanpat View Post
                          I think this applies to any plane with the MCB-E, including the F-18, F-22 and L-39.
                          I'm curious why these receivers? I'm also concerned about how the blue box idea is going to hold up with next gen escs and batteries? I expect Spektrum will be extending their smart battery tech and telemetry with a new series of escs and receivers soon.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Gilatrout View Post

                            I'm curious why these receivers? I'm also concerned about how the blue box idea is going to hold up with next gen escs and batteries? I expect Spektrum will be extending their smart battery tech and telemetry with a new series of escs and receivers soon.
                            Show me a Spektrum ESC that is more than 10A.

                            The Spektrum battery tech is just datalogging the health of the battery, nothing more.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by fredmdbud View Post

                              Show me a Spektrum ESC that is more than 10A.

                              The Spektrum battery tech is just datalogging the health of the battery, nothing more.
                              There's some good things on the way. Three new aircraft receivers, a new RF module which is indicative of a new transmitter and documentation indicating a new series of escs with a new protocol for communication with the receivers.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                I’d be interested why I shouldnt use a 8000/9000 series RX in this plane ?

                                I must say , I had a rudder and steering lock out on my l-39 and was lucky to get it down .

                                I by-passed with a Y lead and no problem since

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by fredmdbud View Post
                                  Something is definitely up with the Blue Box as far as my experiences have gone.I transferred my EDF unit and ESC from my crashed grey F/A-18C to the ARF Plus Blue Angels I also purchased, and I hooked the ailerons, elevators and rudders to a servo tester to cycle them for a few minutes. After a while, the ailerons started twitching, then locked into static positions, which were not symmetrical (equal & opposite deflections). Cycling through the servo tester's modes, the rudders and elevators worked as they should, but the ailerons didn't move. As a test, I put the servo tester in "zero" mode and pushed and pulled on the aileron control rods to see if there was any resistive torque. Though there was some slight resistance, I was still able to move the ailerons with my fingers. Disconnecting the battery, the ailerons moved with much less resistance (as an unpowered servo would). I took a wing off, removed the ribbon cable adapter and connected the servo tester - the aileron servo now worked like it should! My confidence in this part is pretty close to nil at this point.

                                  I posted the above in the F/A-18C thread.

                                  I am amazed that Motion RC was able to pick 12 models at random, assemble and fly them with no incident except for an under-glued stab mount, but here I am with a 2nd F/A-18C that, like the first, exhibits aileron problems on the stand. And not only did I make sure the battery wires were clear of the wing ribbon cables, the failures happened without the ESC powered up.
                                  Like the 737MAX, this bird is grounded until I take that useless plastic trinket out and rewire the wings.
                                  :Angry:

                                  12:29AM update: Trouble ticket also created on MotionRC.com
                                  1:48AM Update: Testing both ailerons individually and directly connected to the servo tester, found that the starboard (right) wing aileron servo is bad - connecting them with a Y causes both to not function properly. And wouldn't you know it, that particular servo (with 10" lead) is out of stock ...

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Fred, not questioning you but if the aileron servo is bad, how does that translate into a faulty BB? With two good servos connected to the aileron ports I wonder if it would work fine I guess is why I am asking. If one bad servo can cause two to not work through a Y harness that doesn't make the Y harness bad but that one may be dragging down the other. The BB is only acting as a Y harness for ailerons as far as I know. Just curious.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by RCjetdude View Post
                                      Fred, not questioning you but if the aileron servo is bad, how does that translate into a faulty BB? With two good servos connected to the aileron ports I wonder if it would work fine I guess is why I am asking. If one bad servo can cause two to not work through a Y harness that doesn't make the Y harness bad but that one may be dragging down the other. The BB is only acting as a Y harness for ailerons as far as I know. Just curious.
                                      Since Hobbysquawk does not offer a strikeout, the text has been greyed out (compare to previous posts with quotes).

                                      But in both of my F/A-18C's, the aileron servos work at first, then start twitching. I also tested the ailerons from my first F/A-18 both without and with the BB, and they now cycle OK in both cases (ran them for 5 minutes). The second one I isolated it to the one servo,which is now completely dead.

                                      Statistically speaking, what are the chances that I would receive two planes that both experienced aileron issues?

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        90mm F22 using Spektrum AR620 - no issues so far

                                        Flying buddy's 90mm F22 using Admiral RX600SP - no issues so far.

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