Super Newb

[crankestein]

Good deal on clocking some air time without buddy box and a instructor. Foamies are cool and so on, but I highly recommend a balsa airplane, the airplane feels so much different. Move from a high wing trainer to low wing, and once you can almost fly it with your eyes closed, then get into the warplanes, or at least dont fly them yet. Making too many shortcuts may bite back on the long run.

Although I dont think its needed for electrics, a AMA license is a plus, and if possible fly at a certified field. You are dealing with lipos, have a portable extinguisher nearby for just in case any lipo catches on fire.

Lets see some pictures of your airplanes, and flying field

[purduephigam]

I purchased an AMA membership, and am official to fly here in our preserves (you pay for a modeler's card to fly/drive boats). There is one field close to me that is set up pretty nice, and has a 200' paved runway. Another field which is private and about 40mins from me has a giant 800' runway, so if/when I get into the bigger jets (a-10, F-15, F-14, F4), I'll be ready for the big boy field. You're right about the short cuts. I was served humble pie twice and am now ready to learn the right way with more practice with these more forgiving planes. I'll get there, just slowly, and certainly will keep everyone posted with my progress as I plan to stay busy with the hobby through the winter.

[purduephigam]

Just an update for everyone; you'll all get a good chuckle. Brought the Pandora and F86 64mm out for maidens this morning. Did all my pre-flight checks, but seemed to ignore the most obvious. Taxi tests were fine (needed to trim out nose gear in order to track straight). Took it to the air only to find the aileron servos were reversed. Total BUSCH League! I somehow managed to guide it safely into a field, but was unable to fly again due to a wing detachment (simple glue fix at home, and now know to always bring glue to the field). Shot to the pills, but the Pandora will fly again no problem. Set up the F86 pre-flight, tossed her into the air and immediately shot out debris through the exhaust tube and fell out of the sky. After inspection, the antenna of my receiver somehow managed to get sucked through the fan, and broke all the blades. 3 batteries charged up for multiple flights and I was out of there in 10mins.....

I can't help but laugh. You'd think I was 10 years old. I suppose a couple hard lessons learned will always be a reminder if/when I am able to work my way up to the big boy jets. Nothing left to do here except get back on the horse tomorrow morning. Everything is charged and ready for the Pandora and I'm hoping for a smooth flight; at the very least a confidence booster.

I wanted to share this, as I know we've all been there. Maybe some more than others. Despite the stubborn hardships I've faced, I'm still determined to log in the time and get myself to fly these things consistently and without knucklehead mistakes. Before I place yet another order to MRC for a new fan for the F86, is there anything else I should add to the list other than a new fan? Any other pearls to add to my experience here?

[wrongroad]

G'day purduephigam,
Yes, I did have a laugh at your expense but only because I have to think how close I have come to doing similar things.:)
Put this in you mind for a control check
Testicles, Spectacles, wallet and watch....AMEN
In other words, forward, backward, right, left, rudder left / right.
When checking your ailerons go, left stick - left [aileron] up....right stick - right [aileron] up. You will never get it wrong if you do it this way before every flight. EVERY flight. Who is to say that someone does not have a play with your transmitter in between flight while your back is turned. I have seen this happen.
And, if some one asks you 'have you checked your ailerons?' Do not dismiss them out of hand but check the rotten things. It takes all of ten seconds.
I asked the very same question of a very experience pilot one day to be told 'of course they are right!' I only asked because he had done repairs during the week and I had a funny feeling about the whole thing.
He took off and promptly rolled into the deck. When he checked the wreckage, guess what he found.:Confused:
A ten second double check would have saved his favorite machine.
When I started, I did not trust my memory to get everything right. I had a written check list that I added to when ever the need arose. And I used it at the field and I might have looked silly to the older pilots who had years of experience, but not one of them ever said that I was dumb for doing this.
In fact, I have saved myself many times by doing this and the times when I thought, 'I wont bother to check it', is the time that I regret it with something being half tight or half falling out. A simple check would have prevented a wheels up landing.
PPPPP. Preparation Prevents P@## Poor Performance.
Once is a mistake you should learn from.
Twice, you did not learn.
Three times you should get a kick up the backside. ;)That is a quote from an old boss of mine and it is a pretty good comment.
It does not hurt to get someone else to double check your model, especially a new one. And confirm with each other that you agree as to the movement.
And, I like the fact that you did not make any excuses for your mistakes.:Cool:
Regards and respect
Daryl

[purduephigam]

Funny you mention the 5 P's. A good friend of mine always said "Proper Planning Prevents Poor Performance." Stuck with me since college, yet sometimes I find myself skipping steps which can ultimately yield.......poor performance. LOL

Another update: went out again this morning determined. 8-9mph crosswind and needless to say I was nervous. Got to the field early to avoid any encounters with other modelers (for embarrassment sake, and overall safety). Did a pre-flight check 3 times as well as multiple taxi tests. I'm confident there's no such thing as a true-tracking nose wheel, unless our runway is everything but flat. After a few deep breaths I took her up. Lots of wind, and swirling wind up high and had a tough time figuring out trim. I'm not sure with wind like this, but I found it more stable with higher throttle input. I have it set up with 3 rates @ 30% expo, and was much more comfortable at the mid-rate (approx 75% throws) as the low rate (50%) was too "mushy." Set my timer at 4min and surprisingly was up before I knew it. I figured this was conservative with my throttle management and in case I needed a couple go-arounds. Luckily I had it set up right for the first approach and dropped it in nicely. Wasn't exactly a beautiful scale flight, but improvement from yesterday and that's all that matters to me. I'll be picking up more batteries so I can spend more time at the field! I'd get after it again tomorrow, but rain is in the forecast. Until next week everyone, hoping to get the Pandora back in the sky as well as the F86.

[Grossman56]

Hey guys, its good advice and the guy who skips it is usually the guy with no airplane at the end of the day
.
We had a fly in a couple of weeks ago and the wind was all over the place, we were going to have a jet flight when the wind came up, I literally stopped in mid taxi, then turned the Avanti around and back to the pit, like Clint Eastwood said,"A man's got to know his limitations"
The little voice in the back of my head said, stay on the ground, so I did.

Ever watch any airplane taxiing out to the runway, the controls are flexing, making sure they're all working.
Brings to mind a story when the first B-17 was in trials with the Air Corps. She'd been extremely successful up until the last flight for her 'utility as a type' test.
Taxied out, headed down the runway climbed out and proceeded to climb to the vertical, stalled and lawn darted.
The cause, the pilot and copilot didn't disengage the elevator control lock, in fact, didn't check for free movement of the controls. The elevator was locked in the up position ( I assume to keep the tail on the ground in case of wind)
Killed all on board if I recall correctly and almost eliminated the B-17 from the Air Corps.
Would have been a very different war......
Think about that the next time someone remarks about checking the control surfaces.

Grossman56

[crankestein]

I have had similar mishaps, not withe reversed, but a day I decided to make the airplane look cool. Bought some stickers for a low wing and placed them on the top frontal area of the wing, running on nitro, it ate the adhesive and off into the skies it went. Just a few feet in the air and immediately the sticker peeled off, and the airplane banked to the right, while the sticker flapped like a flag on top of the wing. Luckily brought it back with rudder, easy on the throttle, and a slight left aileron correction, glided it back in one piece.

But on those one aileron servo setups I have not been that lucky, had cost me two airplanes already. Every chance I get I buy only two servo aileron arf or convert to them.

[Dewey H Lee]

Its great to see your own mistakes and be able to laugh them off. Keep on going ans you'll be soaring with the eagles soon.

[crankestein]

Not sure about your flying location.


If attending a club field and too many mistakes, in the one I am at they'll put you on probation and possibly only allow you to fly with a coach until he/she gives the approval you are good on your own.
Some may not even allow to fly alone when there is no one around for your own safety.

Thats why is good to have the AMA license and fly only in certified fields. Every flight must follow the same safety pre flight checks. I made it a habit while driving to the field to mentally go over all the steps, mistakes start to happen when one gets complacent.

[wrongroad]

Exactly my friend, exactly!
Regards and respect
Daryl

[purduephigam]

Not sure about your flying location.


If attending a club field and too many mistakes, in the one I am at they'll put you on probation and possibly only allow you to fly with a coach until he/she gives the approval you are good on your own.
Some may not even allow to fly alone when there is no one around for your own safety.

Thats why is good to have the AMA license and fly only in certified fields. Every flight must follow the same safety pre flight checks. I made it a habit while driving to the field to mentally go over all the steps, mistakes start to happen when one gets complacent.

You're concerns are certainly warranted. It is an AMA certified field so I am completely insured on all ends in case the unthinkable happens. Me getting there as early as I do is an effort to keep everyone out of potential harms way. Although the field itself its wide open, despite there being a walking trail behind the entrance. Unless the plan completely gets away from me, it'll end up in the grass/fields adjacent to the runway. The field itself is associated with a club, but you don't need to become a member of the club to fly there. As some of you may know, Illinois is weird, and we need to purchase a local preserve permit in order to fly electric planes/boats (just another IL revenue generator).

As for instruction, I would love to buddy up with someone, but my office hours don't line up with the trainers so I am forced to learn on my own for the time being. I'm confident, despite some setbacks, that I will see sound improvement the next couple of weeks as I continue to log time with the Pandora and F86 64mm. Certainly, overall safety is my main concern as I could care less if I lose a plane when it comes down to bodily harm. If anyone's proven anything can happen, it's been me. I was watching youtube the other day and saw a guy's channel where he was flying his A-10 in a parking lot with moving cars; another video he had showed him flying it in his frickin' neighborhood! As if that's not bad enough, he was called out for it in the comments and angrily defended himself.....

Anyways, off tangent. As I've mentioned before, I appreciate everyone's feedback and support through my up and down beginnings. There are always things I can do to improve myself, and it starts with consistency pre-flight. I actually set up my radio to go through a custom pre-flight check before every flight. This will certainly force me to be consistent and avoid complacency.

[Dewey H Lee]

Amen. Very good path you are following. I commend you. I too in the beginning had to teach myself until an opening came at the club i fly at now.:Cool::)

[purduephigam]

Just another flight update for those keeping tabs on my work in progress. Got some new batteries and went out for three flights today with the Pandora. Figured I'd leave the F86 at home so I can get used to everything with the Pandora first. First flight was just fine, some tweaking with trim which involved a significant amount of down elevator to keep it level in flight. Once everything was dialed in, I was very comfortable at my mid-rate setting. I would toggle back and forth between the two at times for comparison. I would imagine I'd probably be too twitchy on high rates so I left things alone there.

1st and 3rd landings were sloppy, but on target. 2nd landing was as smooth as I could ask for. Overall, today was another successful outing and I was actually able to enjoy the crisp air and fall colors rather than worry about my next walk of shame. Also tested my acrobatics with a snap roll; what can I say, I'm a renegade. I definitely need to improve my approaches which will come with time and will likely vary for each and every plane. I suspect without flaps this will take more finesse as I'm more likely to come in hot. But I'd prefer to learn without flaps as a beginner. I'd also like to practice touch-n-go's but have found it difficult as our runway is only about 12' wide.

I don't plan on journaling each and every outing, but figured a few of you might appreciate the improvement coming from where I started. One question for the group: how much rudder do you use in flight? Do you use it for each turn, or just as a compensatory tactic? I imagine I need to better utilize rudder in order to avoid tip stalling, but harmonizing those controls just feels weird to me. Thanks again everyone, happy flying.

[Dewey H Lee]

First the rudder. Most of the time the harmonazation with the rudder and aerolions felling strange is that right now your forcing yourself to think about it. Watch the pandora when you go into a turn with the ails. If you will notice the tail seems to drag around with the plane and not really falling in line. Often times just a little rud feed in makes it all more rounded with out the tail lagging behind. Also you need to depend more on your rudder when on approach and for landings. You can maintain a more leavel correction with the rudder. One of the biggest problems i see with new fliers is on approach or finial and say the wind blows thm off there path or an improper input gets them off heading and they will get on the airlions to try to turn back on coarse and doing so will drop a wing and now there struggling to get there plane back level. On a new person that can be alot to think about in a short time when you are just above the ground. The rudder can be used to turn the plane and then you have very little imputs you have to make on the airls to keep the plane level. The turns with the rudder are a lot more flatter causeing less altitude drop that the ails cause.
You can still practice touch and goes even if you dont land. Since your runway is so narrow set yourself a point at the end of the field and then look past that point to something else to get a line to fly down. Make all of your approaches the same as possible try to keep the fuselage as level as you can(this is where the rudder really comes in). Fly or land down the line you have sighted. Just fly as low as you feel cmfortable and just do a landing in the air. All your trying to do is make your self do the samething all the time and be confident doing it. Before long that 12ft wide runway won't seem to be so narrow. Also useing the rudder during landings greatly reduces you chances of tip stalls unless your just trying to kite it in then your just rolling the dice.

[OV10]

First flight was just fine, some tweaking with trim which involved a significant amount of down elevator to keep it level in flight.

Hello P.........revisit the battery placement. A significant amount of down E trim indicates the bird is tail heavy. Move that battery ahead a 1/4" at a time until you achieve an approx. neutral E position for level flight.
Once you get the skill set built to where you can do inverted flight this CG placement along with E trim determines how much down pressure(should be minimal) is required to hold level inverted flight.
Remember......DON'T RUSH to move on to the other more tantalizing warbirds. Fly the crap out of that Pandora in all it's various configurations.
When you have done that, then the move to tail draggin warbirds should be a relative benign transition.;)

[purduephigam]

Hello P.........revisit the battery placement. A significant amount of down E trim indicates the bird is tail heavy. Move that battery ahead a 1/4" at a time until you achieve an approx. neutral E position for level flight.
Once you get the skill set built to where you can do inverted flight this CG placement along with E trim determines how much down pressure(should be minimal) is required to hold level inverted flight.
Remember......DON'T RUSH to move on to the other more tantalizing warbirds. Fly the crap out of that Pandora in all it's various configurations.
When you have done that, then the move to tail draggin warbirds should be a relative benign transition.;)

Thanks OV. The battery is actually all the way forward and is the recommended pack from MRC (2200 3s). I believe I just had initially set the elevator too high. I made adjustments to the push rod and finalized with trim and sub trim to get it right on.
At this point, I don't anticipate rushing as I'm just starting to get some confidence. I'll stick with this configuration, mess with high rates and attempt to master my landings before I try out the F86 hand launcher. Once I "fly the pants off them" I'll dive into the Rebel. I'd imagine a couple months of that, and I'll be ready for a more intermediate jet.

[Grossman56]

. I suspect without flaps this will take more finesse as I'm more likely to come in hot. But I'd prefer to learn without flaps as a beginner. I'd also like to practice touch-n-go's but have found it difficult as our runway is only about 12' wide..

Hey Purdue, took Pandora One up yesterday as she hasn't flown this year and I had some 3s batteries to unwind for the off season, she's just like an old faithful dog when trimmed right. As noted before, I put the slightly larger motor from the RocHobby Waco into mine and moved my batteries into the canopy hatch and still had to add a bit of tail weight, flip her upside down and put her on a CG machine. Flaps are more for fun with this bird, I drop them and put her nose into the wind to soar. Walk out onto your runway when it's safe to do so and find a landmark that lines up with the center of the runway. If you make your turns over the landmark you'll be on the runway every time with brain bytes to spare for other things like controlling your descent with throttle and keeping the fuselage level while descending. If find that I dead stick the Pandora in anyway otherwise she'll float along on her merry way. Do your 'gear pass' and establish your altitude on your down wind, turn to final over the landmark and bring her in.

Grossman56

[purduephigam]

Duly noted. I'm actually wanting to pick up a pair of skis and hit the snow with this thing. Predictions are that this winter will be a wet one. :Cool:

[Dewey H Lee]

Gman has given sound advice but if you are in the upper wing configuration do not flip the plane upsidedown to check the cg. Top winged aircraft should be done setting right side up.

[purduephigam]

Yes. I am currently in low wing and balanced upside down. :Cool: