Official Freewing 64mm F-86 Sabre Thread

[Aros]

Motion RC is pleased to announce the release of the Freewing 64mm F-86 Sabre. This is the official message thread to post photos, videos, flight reviews and any questions about this aircraft.

[gtbcpa]

I bought the Freewing 64MM F-86 and was ready for first flight. Everything looked great. Control surfaces neutral, etc. And, by the way, an awesome looking plane! So, when it came time to hand launch, I gave it a throw and it immediately rolled on its back and nosed in. So, I go home, repair the damage as best I can, look at some more videos, and give it another try. This time (based on the videos), I decide to do an underhand launch. The same thing happened. I am puzzled because the control surfaces look fine. Could this be torque roll? None of the videos I have seen seem to have that problem. Would a gyro help? Again, this doesn't seem to be necessary after watching the videos. I am using the 1800mah battery. Thanks.

[CFIT rob]

I doubt this is whats going on but i have a 50mm BH f86 that was my first edf (still fly it regularly after 5yrs) that rolled on its back on maiden and i figured out my fingers were sticking to the decals when i threw it. Made it roll to the right as i was throwing it with my right hand. I get my fingertips wet to solve the issue. My 86 has a smaller motor so its not apples to apples but has no noticeable tendency to torque roll nor does my FW f9f panther(also 1800ma batts). I overhand toss both. I always take a few practice throws empty handed to build that muscle memory back to the sticks.

[gooniac33]

I bought the Freewing 64MM F-86 and was ready for first flight. Everything looked great. Control surfaces neutral, etc. And, by the way, an awesome looking plane! So, when it came time to hand launch, I gave it a throw and it immediately rolled on its back and nosed in. So, I go home, repair the damage as best I can, look at some more videos, and give it another try. This time (based on the videos), I decide to do an underhand launch. The same thing happened. I am puzzled because the control surfaces look fine. Could this be torque roll? None of the videos I have seen seem to have that problem. Would a gyro help? Again, this doesn't seem to be necessary after watching the videos. I am using the 1800mah battery. Thanks.

A lot of times it is the way that you are launching the plane. If you hold it like a football it will do like a football.... and spin. The best thing to do is use an underhand toss by placing you hands just a head of the CG and releasing just above waste level. If you want to launch it over hand hold the plane with your thumb and index finger only with the other fingers underneath the plane to point it up just a little. Give it a push with the emphasis being on the last flick of your forearm. Not a football throw. with a 3s pack the plane should be launched at about 3/4 throttle. It should just go out of your hand...

Yes there is torque rolls with edfs as I have proven in a playlist that I have showing it. But the planes only exhibit this with zero airspeed. A good push will get it into the air before it can spin....

[gtbcpa]

A lot of times it is the way that you are launching the plane. If you hold it like a football it will do like a football.... and spin. The best thing to do is use an underhand toss by placing you hands just a head of the CG and releasing just above waste level. If you want to launch it over hand hold the plane with your thumb and index finger only with the other fingers underneath the plane to point it up just a little. Give it a push with the emphasis being on the last flick of your forearm. Not a football throw. with a 3s pack the plane should be launched at about 3/4 throttle. It should just go out of your hand...

Yes there is torque rolls with edfs as I have proven in a playlist that I have showing it. But the planes only exhibit this with zero airspeed. A good push will get it into the air before it can spin....

Thanks for the input. I did try to launch underhand with the second attempt, and the same thing happened. Interestingly, I am readying for another attempt and did a "dry run" in my garage at full throttle while holding it. It did not display any tendencies to roll while I was holding it. It acted like it would go straight and true if I were to launch it. I will try again and post again soon.

[gooniac33]

Thanks for the input. I did try to launch underhand with the second attempt, and the same thing happened. Interestingly, I am readying for another attempt and did a "dry run" in my garage at full throttle while holding it. It did not display any tendencies to roll while I was holding it. It acted like it would go straight and true if I were to launch it. I will try again and post again soon.

here take a look....

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsFORvKk7TcGDr-n3p1EXhNT4SCexkE3I

[dkalwishky]

So, when it came time to hand launch, I gave it a throw and it immediately rolled on its back and nosed in.

A friend has the little Freewing MIG and if when he launches it if it's at full power it will roll left and go into the ground every time. He usually has someone launch it for him, he is at about half power when the plane is launched. As the plane rolls he levels the wings and adds full power and off it goes. Sometimes it takes him two tries to get it flying.

[gtbcpa]

Thank you all for the feedback and the link to videos. I really want to get this figured out because I am wanting to expand my hangar with more EDF jets. Thanks again.

[Kloverzero]

It has been my experience, through many hundreds of hand launches(including the 80mm A-6, and the 80mm F-5) that the secret is a good hard toss. You cannot just simply toss most of these. They will tip stall in a heartbeat if you do not give it enough of a push to get good airflow over the wings. I throw all of my EDF hand launchers over hand, with the wings flat, and about 5 to 10 degrees nose up, HARD. Hope this helps you out!!

[gtbcpa]

Thanks. I greatly appreciate it!

[StormyDog1962]

All good info and also remember to throw it like you are throwing a Dart, any wrist action such as a Baseball or Football throw will impart spin and cause it to roll immediately. If you can get someone to launch it for you the first few times until you get it trimmed out that would be best. If not then a good firm launch is required and understandably after a couple of Dud Launches you get a bit Gun Shy and tend to weaken the throw as you want to reduce any damage if it does not go well. Keep positive thoughts, same as when you are hitting a Golf Ball over water, if you think it is going in the Drink them most likely it will. Envision a good firm toss with a successful fly out. And try 3/4 Throttle and see if that doesn't help with any Torque issues, then after launch add in full throttle.

[gtbcpa]

Thanks. I will keep all of that in mind. And thanks for the appropriate golf analogy. My house is on the 18th hole with a tee shot over a huge body of water. :)

[Aros]

Anybody else flying these successfully?

[chopper]

I was having the same problem launching my F-86 overhand - it would roll over on its back and nose in. After the repairs I went to an underhand launch and it has worked for me every time. Full throttle, holding just in front of CG and releasing about waist high. It's not a strong throw so make sure you have the distance to get over any obstacles. Of course, launching into the wind helps but I've also launched easily with no wind or even against a slight breeze. The landing pods are a bit delicate for the grass football field I have to work with (the tips tend to snag and rip them off since the field isn't exactly smooth) so I've taken to landing it on the paved parking lot and just keep putting gorilla tape on the landing surfaces. It's a blast to fly for a relative EDF newbie like me.

[Bjkeith13]

Has anybody tried to use the 4300 kv motor with a 12 blade fan?

id like to know the difference in thrust between the stock motor with a 12 blade vs the 4000 kv motor. Just trying to keep the weight down if possible since the 4000 kv motor weighs more and is larger. I'd like to cut the weight anywhere I can since I like to use 1800 mah batteries for more flying time, but the extra weight weighs it down a lot in slower flying.

[Bjkeith13]

I have a question for those that purchased the 4000kv 12 fin upgrade. What is the difference in thrust and speed?

also I have found the best way to hand launch. It's to use a sidearm throw by holding the wing and throwing it like a frisbee. Imagine using a forehand tennis swing. I can get a lot more speed and stability that way.

i figured out my problems flying it. I'm 99% sure I had the CG waaaaaaaay off. I estimated the area wrong from the picture in the manual. So using a 2200 mah battery placed all the way forward was making it horrifying to fly. So by placing the battery as far back as I can feasibly put it, the CG is in a much better place. It'll be even further back with the upgrade motor as well. I'm hoping somebody can chime in on the thrust difference between the two motors.

[scootergenie]

I'm currently installing the 12 blade 4s setup found in the 64mm f18. I flew a few dozen flights on 3s and was not really happy with that set up. I tried a dry fit of the 4s 2200 and it balanced perfectly. So I'm changing out the fan, motor, and esc to accept the 4 cell power. I'll let you guys know how it goes. I always bungee launch it, and have a 100 percent success rate.

[Bellke]

I'm having the same problem most people seem to be having, overhand throw like I do for the F-8 Crusader and rolls to the left and noses into the ground. First time ripped off the underwing tanks, 2nd time scuffed up the nose but no damage. I'm really hoping an underhand toss @ 3/4 power will work. I think the plane looks great and want to move to the larger one if this is successful.

[Asher1]

Has anyone tried using a 4 cell bat instead of the 3 recommend

[Race 22 Crew]

I started out with the same issues with launching as many have for my first three attempts. Overhand and underhand attempts that resulted in nose damage twice. I have flown for years and have had several hand launch airplanes. The airplane was in the ground before I could even get my hand on the sticks on two attempts. I’m flying with 3s 2200 batteries so I knew I’m a bit heavy to start with. I fly without tanks and have added wing tip skids to protect the wing servos.

I launch at full throttle and pretty much stay flat out, low alt, high speed fly bys. As my timer goes off at 2.5 mins I’ll make one last pass to a break away at mid field, come back to half throttle, fly the downwind, base and final. Chop throttle as I approach the end of our runway (I land on the grass next to it) and keep wings level as I feed in elevator to keep it just off the ground as the speed bleeds off until it touches down. Cells are right at 3.80V

So after flying it for it for about a year and a half, a couple tips that have worked for me since my first three attempts. Using a straight edge, set the elevators level with the top surface of the horizontal stab. I like the high rate on my elevator so I don’t run out of elevator on approach, and low rate on the ailerons. I have actually toned the ailerons down even more. Mine likes a lot of elevator in the turns to keep the turn level. As you ready for launch, trim in all but a couple clicks of up elevator. I hold the fuselage just behind the wings. Apply full throttle, lift to a 15-20 degree nose up attitude, and give it a good FIRM toss into the wind. Don’t baby it, but you are not throwing a touchdown either. Using this method the airplane will usually fly a nice arc and then start a gentle climb out as it builds speed. It will still occasionally give me a little roll, especially if you have a little cross wind, but you have time to get on the sticks now to level quickly as it climbs out. I will usually start a turn as it climbs out and away. At this point I am trimming out the elevator back to neutral and in my case, two more clicks down to trim for full throttle.

After resetting my elevator neutral to level with the top of the horz, this procedure has worked every time since those first three attempts.

This last week in a decent to make a pass it gave me an uncommanded roll, which I was able to correct, but something didn’t seem right so I landed. I found some wrinkles in the top of the wings that weren’t there before. Upon inspection I found both of the wing spars had broken loose for about three inches on the inboard side. The wrinkles on the top of the wings are right above where the spars broke loose. I would suggest checking your spars if you have been flying yours for a while now. I just about folded my wing. Spar repairs are in progress.

Overall, I really enjoy flying the F86. Its not overpowered by any means and I don’t expect much vertical from it. After a pass, I’ll climb out 45 degrees away to trade the airspeed for altitude, do a smooth turn back for another high speed pass. Repeat repeat and repeat. It is a fun airplane and I look forward to flying it every trip to the field.

Sorry for being a bit long, the info above has worked for me and my setup/flying style. Hopefully my experiences will help someone who may be struggling find what works for them.

Now, do I order the 80mm F86 or the A4?