Any new pre WW II. Biplanes in the pipelines?

[farmflyer]

That was a very good read Konrad you got my interest up I'm going to have to do more research on WWI era planes. Thanks

[doctormike]

There is a very good documentary on the development of the WW1 bipe on NetFlix. It shows a lot about the group in New Zealand who build exact replicas of WW1 bipes, right down to the oil spewing engines. They make no modifications to the original design. Sorry, I don't remember the title. Doc

[Konrad]

Nova: First Air War

[doctormike]

Thanks, Konrad

[fhhuber]

So many planes... so little space :p

[doctormike]

When I was 19, as we drove by Love Field, Dallas, I told a, somewhat, girlfriend how much I love airplanes. She, sort of... well...dissappeared. Doc

[Iowa54]

No Comments from the MRC staff.... keeping secrets or no interest??

[doctormike]

I think WW2 planes, for some reason, are more popular. I'll take a WW1 bipe anytime. Doc

[Iowa54]

I think WW2 planes, for some reason, are more popular. I'll take a WW1 bipe anytime. Doc

Got to agree with you on that. Must be an old barnstormer at heart !

[Alpha]

I love a good early era biplane any day. Unfortunately, foam electric manufacturers have taken a couple risks before with WWI biplanes, and they haven't been home runs, so I can't blame those manufacturers for being hesitant to try again. Hopefully in time they'll revisit WWI subjects (like a Sopwith Camel!) and at that time the product quality will be such that the market will buy the aircraft in quantity and in so doing help to resuscitate manufacturers' willingness to continue with more aircraft from that period.

For the time being, we can at least add our voices for biplanes we'd like to see.

[XF-15DCC]

Hi Alpha,

Being new to the hobby how long ago were there more WWI aircraft and what were some of the problems they were having? Was it demand or quality issues?


Kevin

[Alpha]

Off the top of my head, there is the Dynam Albatros D5a, Parkzone SE5a, Durafly SE5a, FMS Henschel HS 123 (in service 1936-1944), Dynam Tiger Moth (1932-1959), Flyzone Tiger Moth, and Electrifly Fokker DVII. The Fokker was a woodie from a decade ago, and these days HK has their own woodie Fokker D.VII in I think the 1200mm size.

I've flown all the above except the HK Fokker, and I personally thought they were each good models. The two Dynams are my favorite of the lot, and I know many pilots enjoyed their Parzone Se5as. The key though remains volume. I've flown many aircraft which are good aircraft --good quality, good value, good performance, unique subject matter. But how does it sell? Manufacturers are businesses, they need to make what sells. Unfortunately the RC world is littered with good or even great models, which failed to compel people to actually BUY them. I look at the Dynam Albatros D5a as an example. Fun plane, good value, unique look, expansive paint/customization options. I've yet to really meet a guy at the field who says "I don't like it". Instead, just about everyone has said "That plane is cool! That's awesome! I'd love one of those!" But how many of them actually go and BUY the thing? Not a lot.

I suppose the moral of the story is, we as consumers wield a very persuasive power, the power to vote with our wallets. If P-51s in all shapes and sizes continue to sell faster than more obscure offerings, we can't blame the manufacturers when they continue making P-51s. If a model like the Dynam Albatros D5a sold like a P-51 or even close to it, you can bet manufacturers would be scrambling to produce more WWI planes. A good example in the positive is the FlightLine 1200mm La-7. Its sales has proven popular enough that the manufacturer is open to trying another more obscure plane in that lineup, and have decided against another P-51.

On another side of the hobby, there are of course many wood kits of WWI biplanes that warrant a closer look, if you're into building. www.Manzanolaser.com has over 50 WWI models in plans or parts+plans format. Everything from a Sopwith Camel to an Avro 504 to a Vickers 151, and almost everything else in between! Moranes, Nieuports, Bristols, even a Hanriot, you name it! I highly recommend seeing what they have.

[Konrad]

Lets not forget all the great WW1 aircraft that Hobby Lobby imported from the eastern block in the late 90's and at the turn of the century.

[fhhuber]

Dynam Albatros is done right... I really like it. But its not one of the hot ticket WWI planes. The 2 top would be Fokker Dr1 and Sopwith Camel because they are best known. (Snoopy and the Red Baron)

Tiger Moth is actually a WWII era trainer. The Dynam Tiger Moth is done very well. I love mine. Mickey Mouse and Minnie Mouse figures for pilot and copilot.


Most of the others mentioned just weren't done right and didn't fly well.
But I bought them anyway...

The story behind the Tiger Moth is a bit odd. The DH co entered the DH 60 for evaluation as a primary trainer. The British evaluation team said they needed better front cockpit access and to move the exhaust because the pilot and student could get burned to easily.
DH co bent the wings to move the center forward and flipped the engine (those are the primary differences DH 60 to DH 82) The result was a tremendously improved aircraft. The resulting sweep acts to stabilize the aircraft and the resulting thrust line minimized the offset required and allowed a better prop with more clearance.
Essentially "the perfect trainer by accident"

British pilots with just 50 hrs total training in Tiger Moths stepped directly into Hurricanes and Spitfires.
Our pilots who started in Steermans required almost 500 hrs in the air training progressing through Steerman, AT6 and then the fighters...

Tiger Moth had a reputation for showing the student every mistake he made without killing him.
Steeman had a reputation for showing the students their mistakes by killing them...

[Iowa54]

I think the Tiger Moth makes a good RC trainer also. Very forgiving in flight. I'm glad my question has gotten some attention.. Hopefully Dynam or FMS will follow...

[Aros]

I would love for us to start including a WWI line of foamies. The simple elegance of those birds should be better represented in foam. As much as I love my WWII warbirds, I also have a soft spot for the WWI warbirds as well. I am not sure how viable that desire is but it's worth looking into for sure.

[fhhuber]

Certain well known biplanes have been popular... when done right as balsa ARFs.

Pitts Special, Ultimate, The Beast (an upgraded Ultimate) Tiger Moth, Waco, Fokker Dr1, Sopwith Camel, Se5a

Lesser known WWI models don't sell unless the well known ones are there, bought and found to be good aircraft.
Make a bad Dr or Sopwith Camel and the Neuport 17 or 24 don't have a chance of selling many airplanes.

A lot on my wish list just won't happen because they are not well known. There may be a few dozen people out of the whole USA who are interested in a Vickers Vimy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFedpGeMJ04

[farmflyer]

Aros with the ingenuity and forward thinking you at MRC have shown especially on the new products you have recently introduced I'm sure yall can bring in a WWI line that would be met with great success. Like I've stated earlier any thing in the range of size and quality of the parkzone se5a my favorite or the dynam tiger moth would sell. With all the other possibilities out there it would be an exciting new direction to go. I also love the WWII birds and understand their popularity but variety is what keeps us moving forward.

[Konrad]

Looking at how Maxford (Green) Models did not populate the flying fields and seeing how many are discontinued. I would say the market just isn't there for these models.

http://www.maxfordusa.com

And if all folks have flown are the Camels and Dr.1's I don't blame the market from staying away. The SE 5a, Pitts, Ultimates and Stagger wings are about the only nice flying bi-planes and then you have to know how to set them up. Not the best for sales to the novice pilot.

There is a charm in biplanes but great flying attributes is not one of them.

http://www.hobbysquawk.com/forum/rc-airplanes/propeller-airplanes/32235-maxford-green-models-jenny-38

[Iowa54]

That would make a sweet flier... How many kits are needed to put a plane in production and be profitable ? 1000-,5000, ect ??

[fhhuber]

Gotha! :)

EEEEEK!... $300 + motors, ESCs, servos, guns, pilots....

Actually one of the issues Maxford has is size. Another is PRICE!

That Rumpler would be wonderful if in the same scale as Dynam's Albatross.... and at a more reasonable price.