Official Freewing 80mm Avanti S Sport Jet Thread

[Mach9]

New problem. The aileron servos pulled out as they can do because the paint had not been removed before gluing. Freewing uses some kind of silicone adhesive at the factory which is not what is in the tube that comes with it. I scraped and cleaned up everything with 91% Isopropyl alcohol and tried to glue with E6000 which would not stick to the servo. I never had that happen before. I then tried denatured alcohol which is Ethanol cut with Methanol to make it poisonous, Acetone and even brake cleaner. None of them would clean the servo well enough for glue to stick well. The servos still tested good and I did not want to replace them, so I made plates to hold the servos in. I also used threadlock on the horn screw since they can come out and Freewing does not lock them. Sometimes they don't even tighten them! There seems to be some kind of "film" on the servo as if the original adhesive has penetrated the case material. Has anyone else experienced such a freaky problem?

[Mach9]

I finally tried the Scorpion EDF in an Avanti. It works. IMO it is a bit more whooshy, a bit less power and I think a bit less amp draw.

[Mach9]

So far so good with the Powerhobby 6S 5200mAh 50C packs. My first one is 3 years old with 75 flights. Balance is good, power is good, temp is good and no swelling. I don't run my packs down super low so they last longer. I shoot for no less than 3.70 per cell. I kinda doubt the ratings are true as with most things, but it is plenty good for the Avanti. The biggest thing with these is that they are very light at approximately 23 ounces. I have 10 flights on a new pack this year, the HRB 6S 6000mAh 50C. It is doing very well and the extra weight (approximately 29 ounces) is carried easily by the large wing Avanti. I can easily add 30 seconds to the flight time. It even cost less than the Powerhobby. I don't think I would want to go much heavier though. The Avanti would start to venture into the wing loading of a "real" jet and I think I could not handle it. Kudos to the fast heavy jet pilots! The extra weight is also more stress on the landing gear with my "field". The Avanti has made a dream come true for me. Thank You Freewing and Motion RC!

[Mach9]

My 2 cents: I set my rates by the book except low rate aileron is 60% instead of 70% with 50% expo on high and low. I think the 70% low rate would be fine for me now. I always use high rate elevator and rudder with no expo and nearly always use low rate aileron with 50% expo. I have the flaps on a slider for full control anytime and set the full down end point to 30% which I think is 45mm instead of 55mm. I have noticed that I have not had another flap stick problem since reducing the maximum a bit. Perhaps that is simply too much for the servo and it shuts off to protect itself. That would be very good to prove.

[mshagg]

Here are my AR636 settings. I have the low one just to be able to turn it off. I always fly in the middle mode. I should try high rates sometime, but so far don't recall that I have done that. Note that my low aileron rate is 60% and "high" rate is 75%. This is using the holes recommended in the manual, and Tx set to 100% (the AR636 manual recommends to leave the Tx alone and set rates/expo on the Rx side). I'm not claiming these settings are particularly great, but you asked what people use, so this is what I use. Maybe I am old and slow, but to me the Avanti on 100% aileron throw is like trying to fly a buttered corkscrew.

The only suggestion i would make is to experiment with a higher stick priority. At 100%, AS3X gains are zero at full stick deflection (and 50% of your overall gain at 50% stick deflection etc). It can be beneficial to have the gyro gains dialled right down before you reach the end of your stick's travel, so it is not interfering during quick/large movements of the surfaces, but is fully active around centre stick (generally where we want stabilisation doing its thing).

Horizon typically ship their BNF sleds with ~170% stick priority, which roughtly equates to gyro gains being zero for the second half of the stick's travel.

Also just a personal thing but i like dialling in rates and expo on the transmitter rather than baking them into the receiver. Either way the AR636 with a programming cable is a powerful little device, it's a shame they're discontinuing them in favour of the AR637T - for my 2c a pretty obvious effort to lock out people using open source radios with DSMX modules. Typical horizon.

[Gringotuerto]

Gringotuerto to each his own and whatever you like best, but just for kicks, I too use the AR636 in the Avanti (in fact in everything) and if you want, I think you can go to higher gyro rates without any oscillation. I don't use heading hold (just my personal preference) and on rate gains I'm using 40%/45%/50% (R/P/Y) on my flaps up mode (have the 3 modes tied to Aux1-the flaps). On take-off and landing flaps I'm at 70%/75%/80% and priority across the board at 140. I leave the D/R in the receiver at 100/100 and Expo at 0 and instead program my D/R and Expos in the transmitter tied to a 3 position switch. ....

Thanks for info, it seems there is quite a range of usable settings on this. I also don't really like heading gain, and was a little surprised to see it in my own setup (although on a switch position that I never use). I guess I was in an experimenting mood when I set this, because most of my planes have 0 heading gain on all three switch positions.

[Hugh Wiedman]

Here are my AR636 settings. I have the low one just to be able to turn it off. I always fly in the middle mode. I should try high rates sometime, but so far don't recall that I have done that. Note that my low aileron rate is 60% and "high" rate is 75%. This is using the holes recommended in the manual, and Tx set to 100% (the AR636 manual recommends to leave the Tx alone and set rates/expo on the Rx side). I'm not claiming these settings are particularly great, but you asked what people use, so this is what I use. Maybe I am old and slow, but to me the Avanti on 100% aileron throw is like trying to fly a buttered corkscrew.

Gringotuerto to each his own and whatever you like best, but just for kicks, I too use the AR636 in the Avanti (in fact in everything) and if you want, I think you can go to higher gyro rates without any oscillation. I don't use heading hold (just my personal preference) and on rate gains I'm using 40%/45%/50% (R/P/Y) on my flaps up mode (have the 3 modes tied to Aux1-the flaps). On take-off and landing flaps I'm at 70%/75%/80% and priority across the board at 140. I leave the D/R in the receiver at 100/100 and Expo at 0 and instead program my D/R and Expos in the transmitter tied to a 3 position switch. I know you are "supposed to" program the D/R and expo in the receiver, but I much prefer to be able to throw a switch on the transmitter to change them instead of being tied to gyro rates (and in my case flap position). I've done that on over 25 636's and never had a problem with that, so not sure why they want you to program those in the receiver. So much easier to adjust in the transmitter and allows 9 flight configurations (3 D/R/Expo on each of 3 flap positions).

On my D/R I'm using 80%/85%/90% on Ailerons but have my Expo way up to 50%. So in effect, the aileron travel is minimal during the 1st 1/2 of stick movement, but if I want it all, then I can get it by just using almost full stick movement. I know I'm definitely in the minority on using this much expo but started to really like it with the 3D planes and now I use more expo on virtually everything, from prop warbirds to EDF's and of course 3D planes. With Expos that high, it almost acts like it is in low rates the first 1/3 stick movement, then mid rates the next 1/3 and high rates the last 1/3. You don't have to say it, I know, I'm a little weird, but that's what I'm comfortable with now. For Elevator I'm using 80%/95%/110% with 50% Expo and on the Rudder I'm at 95%/115%/115% with 30% Expo. I usually fly in mid rates which is why the rudder is at 115% in both mid and high rates for knife edge. One thing I've been surprised at with the Avanti is it's ability to maintain a perfect knife edge without any mixes for elevator or aileron. Even at 75% throttle with 115% rates, it has enough authority to gain altitude. What a beautifully flying machine!!

[rcfun]

Hope you get it dialed in the way you like it !!

[Gringotuerto]

Gringotuerto...

i think i remember seeing you have the larger avanti also , did you have that as EDF or turbine ? what do you think of performance ?...

It is a 120mm EDF on 12S. I have only flown it two times, and don't have the CG right yet, so it is a bit early to know exactly how it behaves. I can say for sure that it is NOT simply a larger version of the foam Avanti. The foam Avanti can float in for landing very slowly, with little or even no power. A big fiberglass jet cannot do that...it would fall out of the sky like a rock without power. So it is more challenging to fly for sure. The speed at least in my setup is not any higher than the Freewing Avanti, because I have motor and ducting optimized more for static thrust than maximum efflux velocity. To me that makes it feel a little more responsive, but it reduces top speed.

[rcfun]

It's quarantine, everybody's rear is a little heavier. OK, but seriously, I have owned 2 and didn't notice much difference. But I think both were older that the present version. Now I see the following note on Motion RC site: "This is the High Performance version of the Freewing Avanti S 80mm. This version includes a powerful 3658-1857kV inrunner motor with 12-blade fan, 100A ESC and hybrid metal gear servos." So I am guessing the new power system (which is aft of the CG) must be heavier...? I don't know. The initial version had a 12 blade fan, and I had one of those. The one I have now was from about a year or two ago, and has a 9-blade fan. Now it seems they are back to 12-blade again. It seems they revise it from time to time, and I lost track of all the versions.

Gringotuerto , thanks for heads up ,

i think i remember seeing you have the larger avanti also , did you have that as EDF or turbine ? what do you think of performance ?

thanks, joe

[Gringotuerto]

...the one from couple years ago , a 6s 6000 batt all the way to rear

now the same battery is all the way to the front

what has changed so much...

thanks, joe

It's quarantine, everybody's rear is a little heavier. OK, but seriously, I have owned 2 and didn't notice much difference. But I think both were older that the present version. Now I see the following note on Motion RC site: "This is the High Performance version of the Freewing Avanti S 80mm. This version includes a powerful 3658-1857kV inrunner motor with 12-blade fan, 100A ESC and hybrid metal gear servos." So I am guessing the new power system (which is aft of the CG) must be heavier...? I don't know. The initial version had a 12 blade fan, and I had one of those. The one I have now was from about a year or two ago, and has a 9-blade fan. Now it seems they are back to 12-blade again. It seems they revise it from time to time, and I lost track of all the versions.

[rcfun]

wow , huge difference in battery placement on the newer upgraded avanti

the one from couple years ago , a 6s 6000 batt all the way to rear

now the same battery is all the way to the front

what has changed so much on the new upgraded avanti to cause battery to shift so much ?

thanks, joe

[Rudy’s pilot]

Rudy’s pilot Gyros and rates/expo are not correlated. You should still set up your rates. Also, if you are able to program the gyro on a switch so you can turn it off if need be that would be great. I fly the Avanti without a gyro and it as stable as a rock. For me, a gyro would come in handy on days with crosswinds and for some advanced maneuvers.

Rates are personal preference. I have expo on the rudder, but no rates or switch. High speeds = high roll rate. My aileron mid is 65% with 35% expo and low is 50% with 40% expo. I use the mid when going fast and rarely use the low. I also put 35-40% expo on the elevator with a lower rate setting (can't remember) for cruise and high speed flight. I like having the elevator and aileron rates on separate switches, especially for a maiden. You may find that you'd like to dial back your ailerons but not your elevator. This has cost me a plane in the past.

Good luck.

Thank you now days I need all the help I can get! Things are not going good.

[The Sheriff]

Maybe I am old and slow, but to me the Avanti on 100% aileron throw is like trying to fly a buttered corkscrew.

LOL, agreed.

[Gringotuerto]

I have the Avanti S 80mm Jet. I also have the Admiral RX600 receiver, can you still use low dual rates and expo or does the gyro eliminate the need to set them up? I have low rates of 70% Ailer. Expo 30% Rudd. 80% Expo 35%.
I watched the videos, but just wondering if anybody has the experience of flying with this Gyro with the Avanti and if you could share your experience. Cheers mate,

Here are my AR636 settings. I have the low one just to be able to turn it off. I always fly in the middle mode. I should try high rates sometime, but so far don't recall that I have done that. Note that my low aileron rate is 60% and "high" rate is 75%. This is using the holes recommended in the manual, and Tx set to 100% (the AR636 manual recommends to leave the Tx alone and set rates/expo on the Rx side). I'm not claiming these settings are particularly great, but you asked what people use, so this is what I use. Maybe I am old and slow, but to me the Avanti on 100% aileron throw is like trying to fly a buttered corkscrew.

[Bgelok]

I dont have an answer to your question, but personally i would not run a gyro with the $5 servos. They will wear out quickly and cause problems. Just my honest opinion. And indint think this jet needs it. I flew mine in 25+ kmh winds without an issue.

[The Sheriff]

Rudy’s pilot Gyros and rates/expo are not correlated. You should still set up your rates. Also, if you are able to program the gyro on a switch so you can turn it off if need be that would be great. I fly the Avanti without a gyro and it as stable as a rock. For me, a gyro would come in handy on days with crosswinds and for some advanced maneuvers.

Rates are personal preference. I have expo on the rudder, but no rates or switch. High speeds = high roll rate. My aileron mid is 65% with 35% expo and low is 50% with 40% expo. I use the mid when going fast and rarely use the low. I also put 35-40% expo on the elevator with a lower rate setting (can't remember) for cruise and high speed flight. I like having the elevator and aileron rates on separate switches, especially for a maiden. You may find that you'd like to dial back your ailerons but not your elevator. This has cost me a plane in the past.

Good luck.

[Rudy’s pilot]

I have the Avanti S 80mm Jet. I also have the Admiral RX600 receiver, can you still use low dual rates and expo or does the gyro eliminate the need to set them up? I have low rates of 70% Ailer. Expo 30% Rudd. 80% Expo 35%.
I watched the videos, but just wondering if anybody has the experience of flying with this Gyro with the Avanti and if you could share your experience. Cheers mate,

[Robbie9859901]

Yikes!!! What a plane. Yeah, if I get smooth with that the sky's the limit, pun intended. :)

You have to throttle back right after take off. I increased the flaps to 60 degrees to get over the idle thrust on the turbine one. If you are using your transmitter, you can set up flight modes. Then you can trim for different flap settings and the Tx will remember them. It makes speed control much easier.

[JmanAZ]

The F-86 EDF and turbine would be good. That would get you to think faster. They are harder than the Avanti.

Yikes!!! What a plane. Yeah, if I get smooth with that the sky's the limit, pun intended. :)