Official FMS 1500mm P-47D Razorback Thread

[davegee]

Good video! Thanks for posting it. The paddle blade prop really enhanced the performance of the P-47 in WWII. Good thing we came up with it back then!

Cheers

Davegee

[f4u ausie]

Ha ha my son walked past at last minute. He put the link

[f4u ausie]

Hey Dave and anyone else that's interested. ..hope U r well.. U may have watched already.. but. If not. It's about the development of the p47 paddle blade.. very cool.. and since the dumb Ozzy. Isn't sure how to put the link here... Just a pic.. sure U will find it.

[davegee]

Thank you both! I'll take both of your advice and also do my maiden with the stock propeller. I'll attach photos from my maiden whenever I get enough time and courage to do it!

Thanks again,
Eagle15

Sounds like a good plan! I had a FMS P-47D back in 2019 and flew it solely on the stock propeller. Flew great! I didn't even think seriously about working on a larger more scale prop until just a couple of years ago. I traded notes with f4uaussie who is a frequent contributor to Hobby Squawk and we both came up with a flyable larger propeller for this aircraft. I'm sure there were others too, that did this.

I think you'll find the FMS jug to be a real pleasure to fly, just like the pilots of the real ones did. With its very wide wheel stance, it is very stable and tracks beautifully down the runway. Please keep us in the loop how finishing this plane goes and how the maiden goes whenever you do it down the road. Check in with Callie Graphics, she'll fix you up with great stickers to do your Gabreski P-47.

Cheers

Davegee

[Eagle15]

Thank you both! I'll take both of your advice and also do my maiden with the stock propeller. I'll attach photos from my maiden whenever I get enough time and courage to do it!

Thanks again,
Eagle15

[davegee]

I second LB’s recommendation. Callie would be very familiar with famous planes like Gabreski’s. Or, you can just come up with Something to give her a start, and she’ll fix you up!

Go over to FMS website and get the parts for the 1700mm V3 Corsair.

You’ll need the larger aluminum prop shaft (interchangeable with the stock one that comes with the kit.)

Four V3 Corsair propellers. If you can afford it, get two packs because it is very easy to scrape or break a prop that is much larger, though more scale.

V3 prop hub that you’ll use to mount the props after they are slimmed down a bit to fit. You can use the stubbier Ham Stand prop dome or I probably have an extra Curtiss printed dome you can have. Most P-47s had the electric props and pointy prop domes although some blocks had the HS stubbier, fatter prop domes.

I think you’ll be back on the right track with the above recommendations. Let me know how it goes or any questions.

Cheers

davegee

[Elbee]

By the way, what did you use for your markings? I’m looking to get some decals to model Gabreski’s first or second HV-A with 6 kill markings...
Cheers,
eagle15

Eagle15,

Best source I've found for custom markings and nomenclature is Callie Graphics here in the States.

https://callie-graphics.com/collections/p-47-thunderbolt

If you have pictures, etc, she will custom design and print anything.

Looking forward to seeing your finished T-Bolt.

Post pictures, please, and welcome to Hobby Squawk, Sir, glad to have you onboard.

Best, LB

[Eagle15]

Hi Eagle15: This is a vexing part of making this mod. I ordered the prop hub, spinner, and larger aluminum prop hub that bolts in place of the original smaller stock FMS parts that have a much smaller prop. So, be sure you are using all the right parts to begin with. None of the original stock 1500mm P-47 FMS parts will work for this mod. They all need to be FMS Corsair V3 props and other parts from the 1700mm Corsair model. You can order all you need from FMS.

Assuming you have all those V3 Corsair FMS parts, you can now begin. I don't know why the propeller bases don't fit into the receptacles in the FMS V3 prop hubs. It's like they were made for two different designs! But every time I order new parts from FMS, the same mismatch happens. What I have done in this case (happens with all three of my P-47s) but I have to use a dremel tool and belt sander to reduce the diameter of the bases of the props that are supposed to fit in the hubs and then get screwed down. If you are careful, it can be done and the screws should tighten down so that they are secure. I've never had a problem with any of my props staying secure in their mounts using this procedure.

Let me know if you are using the larger parts for the V3 Corsair 1700mm prop. That is a key, But even if you are, you have to patiently sand down those propeller bases' diameters a bit so that they fit into the recesses and can be screwed tight. It is possible, and I have done it and have dozens of flights on all my P-47s with the bigger, more scale props.

Regarding your comment about possibly using superglue to keep the prop blades in place, I would be highly doubtful of that working. The power coming off of this motor and prop is tremendous! In my opinion, the only safe way to go forward is to be able to use those bolts and nuts to tighten it down securely so there is no way the prop can get loose. This could be a disaster if you just glued it down and then tried to fly it. IMHO, you need to get the fit, screws, and bolts figured out if you want to use the larger V3 prop system.

Good luck!

Hi Davegee,

Thanks for the info: I was using the original fms 1500 p47 parts the whole time! I ended up cutting and slightly sanding down the Corsair props to fit in there! No wonder it felt and looks wrong lol. Now I gotta order another whole set of propellers… dang it that’s another 20 dollars down the drain… worth it for a p47. anyway, thanks again for the info, this time hopefully the propellers will actually fit with some patient sanding! Thanks for the photos too, your thunderbolts look awesome. By the way, what did you use for your markings? I’m looking to get some decals,
to model Gabreski’s first or second HV-A with 6 kill markings, but have no idea how or where to get them from. I’ll attach some photos of my thunderbolt and prop for now. You can see how I cut down the propeller to fit the razorback part lol. It was rather wobbly so I thinking about using superglue to secure it down . .. Good thing I didn’t!

Cheers,
eagle15

[davegee]

hi Davegee, how did you get your Corsair prop in the p47 spinner? I’ve tried sanding/cutting the propeller down, and although it fits, it’s a little wobbly. Also, the screw doesn’t go all the way through, which makes it difficult to secure the propeller completely. I’m considering supergluing the propeller down at this point 😂 but I was wondering how you did it, as you got not one but three p47s. I like all your paint jobs as well, I’ve attempted to paint mine as Gabriel’s very first razorback with the classic white cowling and identification bands on the back. I have yet to fly it due to weather, but I’m looking forward to it every day!

Hi Eagle15: I found an older pic of a now defunct FMS 1600mm P-47D. This is in the scheme you were thinking about (Gabby Gabreski) but with a plane called Hairless Joe flown by Dave Schilling. Gabreski and Schilling were contemporaries so your model would look good customized for one of Gabreski's airplanes during WWII. Be aware that paint schemes were changing rapidly during this time in WWII, so you have to sorta pick a particular look in time and stick with it.

I posted this pic to show you the stock FMS prop, although when I was flying this plane a few years ago before it crashed, I was doing some 3D printed experimentation of the propeller hub. This one is not quite the right size or shape for this particular smaller stock prop, but I was able to get the final proper size and shape with the help of folks like Elbee. The development of the larger V3 prop started after this plane, and was ongoing for a year or more.

You might want to just fly your plane for awhile on the smaller stock propeller like I have done on all my jugs before stepping up to the FMS V3 props. It does fly fine on the stock prop and this would be valuable experience for you getting used to the intended stock prop before working on upgrading what we were discuassing earlier.

Cheers

Davegee

[davegee]

Hi Eagle15: This is a vexing part of making this mod. I ordered the prop hub, spinner, and larger aluminum prop hub that bolts in place of the original smaller stock FMS parts that have a much smaller prop. So, be sure you are using all the right parts to begin with. None of the original stock 1500mm P-47 FMS parts will work for this mod. They all need to be FMS Corsair V3 props and other parts from the 1700mm Corsair model. You can order all you need from FMS.

Assuming you have all those V3 Corsair FMS parts, you can now begin. I don't know why the propeller bases don't fit into the receptacles in the FMS V3 prop hubs. It's like they were made for two different designs! But every time I order new parts from FMS, the same mismatch happens. What I have done in this case (happens with all three of my P-47s) but I have to use a dremel tool and belt sander to reduce the diameter of the bases of the props that are supposed to fit in the hubs and then get screwed down. If you are careful, it can be done and the screws should tighten down so that they are secure. I've never had a problem with any of my props staying secure in their mounts using this procedure.

Let me know if you are using the larger parts for the V3 Corsair 1700mm prop. That is a key, But even if you are, you have to patiently sand down those propeller bases' diameters a bit so that they fit into the recesses and can be screwed tight. It is possible, and I have done it and have dozens of flights on all my P-47s with the bigger, more scale props.

Regarding your comment about possibly using superglue to keep the prop blades in place, I would be highly doubtful of that working. The power coming off of this motor and prop is tremendous! In my opinion, the only safe way to go forward is to be able to use those bolts and nuts to tighten it down securely so there is no way the prop can get loose. This could be a disaster if you just glued it down and then tried to fly it. IMHO, you need to get the fit, screws, and bolts figured out if you want to use the larger V3 prop system.

Good luck!

Davegee

[Eagle15]

Beautiful summer morning to take my FMS P-47D out for a flight. Didn't have the time for several weeks to fly this one, one of three FMS P-47s that I own. Love flying all three of them when I can. This one, Hairless Joe, flew wonderfully on its Corsair V3 prop and scratchbuilt printed propeller cuffs and Curtiss Electric type spinner. Definitely seems to have a little more power with that big blade, and certainly Looks better in the air and on the ground. Also flew my E Flite Beech 18 which is a reliable workhorse just for fun flying.

Davegee

hi Davegee, how did you get your Corsair prop in the p47 spinner? I’ve tried sanding/cutting the propeller down, and although it fits, it’s a little wobbly. Also, the screw doesn’t go all the way through, which makes it difficult to secure the propeller completely. I’m considering supergluing the propeller down at this point 😂 but I was wondering how you did it, as you got not one but three p47s. I like all your paint jobs as well, I’ve attempted to paint mine as gabreski’s very first razorback with the classic white cowling and identification bands on the back. I have yet to fly it due to weather, but I’m looking forward to it every day!

[davegee]

Today marks the 81st anniversary of the start of the ill-fated Operation Market Garden campaign in Holland. The plan was to take a series of important bridges culminating in taking Arnhem with a bridgehead to jump into Germany and end the war early, maybe by Christmas of 1944. The plan started falling apart for several reasons and the attack failed with a large loss of life. The movie "A Bridge Too Far" covers the ground attack fairly well, I think. I did get to visit Arnhem and the surrounding area on bicycle after taking a train from Amsterdam many years ago. It was a memorable day trip.

On the air side, one of the principal units involved was the famous 56th Fighter Group based out of Boxted, England. Their job was to suppress anti aircraft batteries supporting the parachute and glider invasion. They took tremendous losses that day, with 16 lost out of 39 aircraft dispatched.

My FMS 1500mm P-47D that I've flown for over 5 years is a replica of one of the planes that fought that day. It flew on D-Day and then was damaged over Holland but made it back to the base. But a gear broke off on landing and the airplane was a writeoff.

My "I Wanted Wings/Button Nose" flew this morning commemorating the event in WWII. I almost had a similar ending as the real one did when one of my main gear wouldn't come down. But eventually I recycled it a few times and it landed just fine. Worked fine on the ground. Go figure!

I'll attach a couple pics of the model after my flight.

Cheers

Davegee

[davegee]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1rxT7Sn-xY

A Joyful Noise.... to me anyway.

Best, LB

Totally agree! This one has one of the newer "C" series engines that had even More power!

Cheers

davegee

[Elbee]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1rxT7Sn-xY

A Joyful Noise.... to me anyway.

Best, LB

[davegee]

just in case you guys missed it...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yncBUBoQVbE

Great video

Grossman56
(Dangerous Dan)

Thanks for posting that, Dan. I have seen it before, but always good to see it again. This fighter group was highlighted near the end of the war in Europe, with lots of cameras in the cockpits and elsewhere to document what low alititude fighter missions were like, and in color, too. I had a good friend, now since passed, who told me about a time he and his wingman were flying low, looking for "targets of opportunity." They were flying the new M model, the hottest fighter at the time. They came across a small locomotive, approached it at a 90 degree angle and both planes unleashed a combined sixteen 50 caliber machine guns simultaneously, roaring like a bat outta hell low to the ground. The locomotive responded by falling over on its side! That was a LOT of power!

Davegee

[f4u ausie]

Hey gross just came across this (above). On tv u tube.... Shoulda looked at it when u posted it anyway. Great video. But 1 thing I learned and never new(U alluded to it). Give em the whole 9 yards.. !!!
My grandad was always saying it.. he grew up in a ruff neighbourhood.
And fought in Africa.. anyways. Now I no where that saying come from.. and I've learned not to ignore the squark team in the future dick parker from the 9th. Was the one. Cya 4 now

[Grossman56]

just in case you guys missed it...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yncBUBoQVbE

Great video

Grossman56
(Dangerous Dan)

[Elbee]

Success creates confidence. Glad this design is working for you, Again, you are welcome.

[davegee]

I took "Ole Cock" FMS P-47D razorback up for two test flights today with the modified Elbee prop cuffs and CE prop dome design. Both flights went great, Prop very solid, and I couldn't nail down any deficiencies of this modified FMS Corsair V3 prop versus the same prop without the prop cuffs. The cuffs, glued onto the props in the way I did, are rock solid and don't budge a bit before, during, or after flight inspections. My other two FMS P-47s used the Hamilton Standard prop and dome and have never shown any problems in flying. So, I'm happy this project has worked out, even with the challenges it presented coming to this point.

Elbee, thanks again for your help and assistance designing the CE prop dome that I printed out, and the prop cuffs which work so well now. My friend at the Ace Hardware who is working on a different design sleeve for the prop cuffs will have them ready for me soon, and I will also give them a try to see how they do.

A few pics taken this morning at the field after the two flights were completed on my P-47 "Ole Cock."

Cheers

Davegee

[davegee]

Davegee, Elbee,
Nice looking jet. Would be a great group build. My main build this year will be the Phantom, but it's not like I haven't had more than one build going at a time. Air Force Museum has several F-86s on display so getting good pictures of the details wouldn't be a problem.
Best Regards, Rex

Yeah, your proximity to Dayton is a big plus for doing field trips to check out details on varous aircraft! I just bought a book on Amazon, one of the numerous "walk arund" books on th eF-86. That is also a good source of info for these models.

Cheers

Davegee