Avios/Hobby King 1600mm C-130 Hercules

[Hardway]

Better just hand launch it Bro!!! Good luck!!! Have a great Sunday!!!! Jerry

[icepirate3]

I opened up my BA and didn't find anything loose or any obvious signs of problems. The only two things I can think of that would cause all 4 engines to stop simultaneously and still have control would be the white multi function board or the receiver. I'm using a nee Lemon 10ch with satellite. I am going to put the receiver from my other Herc in and see what happens. If I'm missing something I'm open to suggestions.

Was able to salvage one door and have decided not to repaint or even clean it up. It's not worth making it look nice if I can't trust it will stay airborne.

[icepirate3]

Update on my BA. I was ruling out the possibility of a signal loss or receiver issue causing all 4 engines to quit as I assumed I would have lost control of everything. Turns out, I may have been very wrong in that assumption. When I did the range check before the maiden, I could hear and see the control surfaces moving and kept walking as I could still see the elevator and rudder moving. (mistake) Called it a good range check (mistake 2) and took off. Lost all 4 engines a couple minutes later but still had control of the surfaces.

Took it back to the field yesterday and as I got a good distance away during the range check, I could hear the ESC's reset (beep). Huh oh. Took it back to the stand and had someone stand next to it while I did another check and they confirmed that the surfaces started to get jittery and the ESC's reset. So it's probably safe to say that the receiver is the issue, which is a relief to be honest. Lesson learned is to get out of the habit of not asking for someone to watch the plane during a range check!!

Not sure if I'm going to order another Lemon. May go with an Admiral as I've had good luck with them.

[icepirate3]

So into my BA out today after relocating the receiver and satellite after loosing all 4 engines on the maiden a couple weeks ago. It failed range check again. So I plugged a different receiver in that I had just used in my Avanti and it seemed to pass so I taxied around a bit and when I got close to the end of the runway I again lost all 4 engines. After about 5 or so seconds I hear the esc's initialize again and I had power to taxi back. Now I'm confused. So to rule out a corrupt model file in my iX12 I bind the original Lemon receiver to my other C130 file which doesn't have similar issues (it has it's own, trust me). Did a range check and it seemed fine so I taxi out and again loose all 4 engines about 300 feet away. I've ruled out a bad receiver. I think I've ruled out the TX. I guess at this point I'm going to submit a ticket and see what HK has to say. It's a strange problem for sure but I can't deny that my frustration level is topped out. $700+ on two Hercs and they are both decorations. (Not really the BA as it's scratched up pretty bad from the maiden crash).

[xviper]

Have you considered the condition of the "Y's" that join all 4 ESC throttle leads? Maybe replace them with known good ones. It's likely that's where the RX gets its power from.

[icepirate3]

I did check all of them after the maiden crash but will look into maybe replacement.

[JamesonC]

So into my BA out today after relocating the receiver and satellite after loosing all 4 engines on the maiden a couple weeks ago. It failed range check again. So I plugged a different receiver in that I had just used in my Avanti and it seemed to pass so I taxied around a bit and when I got close to the end of the runway I again lost all 4 engines. After about 5 or so seconds I hear the esc's initialize again and I had power to taxi back. Now I'm confused. So to rule out a corrupt model file in my iX12 I bind the original Lemon receiver to my other C130 file which doesn't have similar issues (it has it's own, trust me). Did a range check and it seemed fine so I taxi out and again loose all 4 engines about 300 feet away. I've ruled out a bad receiver. I think I've ruled out the TX. I guess at this point I'm going to submit a ticket and see what HK has to say. It's a strange problem for sure but I can't deny that my frustration level is topped out. $700+ on two Hercs and they are both decorations. (Not really the BA as it's scratched up pretty bad from the maiden crash).

Any update on what you found?

[Husafreak]

Have the bugs been worked out of this Avios C-130? I was all set to buy one when they were first introduced but early reliability reports were poor. So I decided to wait a year. And here on this thread we have another unsatisfied customer, icepirate3. I am not averse to minor modifications (BEC, servo distribution board, etc) but the motors, esc's, and servos should be adequate out of the box before I would purchase one.
I flew the C-130 for many years in the USAF so yeah, I really want one.

[xviper]

Have the bugs been worked out of this Avios C-130? I was all set to buy one when they were first introduced but early reliability reports were poor. So I decided to wait a year. And here on this thread we have another unsatisfied customer, icepirate3. I am not averse to minor modifications (BEC, servo distribution board, etc) but the motors, esc's, and servos should be adequate out of the box before I would purchase one.
I flew the C-130 for many years in the USAF so yeah, I really want one.

I bought this plane when it was in the second production run and I'm flying it bone stock. It's been a terrific plane. The only thing I had to do was re-glue the main retract box as it came loose. The front retract door control arm broke and I had to epoxy that back on.

[wvrailfan]

I'm still flying mine, which was one of the first from the first batch. I have replaced the ramp servo, other than that it is still bone stock.

JB

[Husafreak]

Thanks guys, that sounds reasonable! With the Avios C-130 representing my USAF days and the possibility of a Motion RC B737 representing my current ride I could be one happy camper ;)

[Enterprise206]

Just picked one up brand new for 300$ from Perry. Haven’t looked at the manual yet. Any CG suggestions and maybe using more then one battery?. Got the Fat Albert scheme.

[xviper]

I'm using a single Graphene, 2200mah, 4s, which is a bit heavier than a "normal" 2200. The battery strap had to be relocated so the battery could be mounted side-ways (as opposed to the usual longitudinally) and as far back as possible to make the book CG at 65mm. I've seen some people put a larger battery also "side ways", but at an angle rather than flat on the floor. You could mount 2X2200's sideways, one on top of the other and it would be only a bit nose heavy, which I think the plane can handle. You'd have to make a strap that can support the top battery from falling forward off the bottom battery. Or, you could put the second battery longitudinally with the front of it over the first sideways battery and rig up some velcro on that lip and shove the rest of the second battery back where all the wiring comes through.
With my single 2200, I have my timer set for 4:20 and so long as I don't fly it at max throttle, the battery comes down at a safe voltage. For me, 4:20 is plenty for a single flight. I usually fly it a second time on the same size battery.

[rifleman_btx]

I was bummed when my buddy brought his to the field. I think he had balance issues with his, and it crashed on landing. He said it felt squirrely though out the flight. So that lead me to believe it was a balance issue. Was sad to see it go.

[PropRocket]

I had a similar experience to icepirate3. On my first attempt to fly mine, about a year ago, it kept loosing power while taxiing as if there was a signal problem. All four propellers would stop rotating and I had no servo control. Within a second or two, the ESC's made their start up tones and I had power again until I tried to taxi. I assumed it was a radio problem so I replaced the receiver and did some taxi checks in my driveway at home with no issue. I took it back to the field and did a few more taxi checks and never lost power. I gave full power to take off and shortly after the plane broke ground it lost power and I had no control. It suffered significant damage but I made a project out of repairing it.

With it back to flight ready status, I did taxi and max power checks to try and duplicate the issues I previously had. Everything seemed to be working. I took it out to the field and started my takeoff run. It broke ground and I started to turn right. However, about 2 seconds after takeoff I heard a strange tone that almost sounded like the plane was sadly saying "Uh-oh". It lost power to the motors but I still had servo control (note: I never tried to retract the gear as I was waiting until I completed a single pattern). Unfortunately, loosing power right after takeoff is never an easy recovery and it stalled almost immediately and hit the ground hard. I suspect that the low voltage cutoff was triggered but when I recovered the battery, it was still at about 90%. I am doing a lot of electrical systems checks because I bet something it drawing way too much current, or the low voltage cutoff is too high. So far, I am replacing the inboard flap servos (likely all of the wing servos while I'm at it) because they sound terrible and are drawing as much as 240mA even after I trim them. I will disconnect the flaps, cargo door, and fuselage lighting for the next attempted flight to rule them out for sure should I crash again.

Lastly, what should the output voltage of the BEC be set too? I always assumed this should be 5V as it is a standard servo voltage but mine was set to 5.5V. I changed it to 5V because I can't find anything saying otherwise and a voltage increase on the servos, especially one that is higher than they are rated at, can obviously cause problems. I can't say that it hasn't been fun making these major repairs but I do want this thing to fly. Eventually, I will buy a new fuselage if they ever show up in the US warehouses.

[xviper]

@PropRocket Mine's been flying stock since the second factory run of the grey version. The BEC is set at whatever it was set at when it came. Nothing has been changed on it. I doubt the servos care whether the BEC is set at 5v or 5.5v. Yours doesn't seem to be a servo problem anyway. It seems when you bounce it down the runway, the power flow stops. I'd be looking at a bad solder somewhere along the power flow route. Did you check the solder on battery connector on the plane side? How about the connector on the battery itself? I've had bad solders in those that one of the wires could just be pulled out with light force, especially after being warmed up. When that can happen, that tells me that the solder was very poor and current can be intermittent or reduced considerably. Was the connector hot to touch after the crashes? Since all 4 engines quit, it not going to be any of the individual ESCs. It's likely in the power distribution upstream of those, hence, my previous statement about bad solders. It could also be poor connections in the control box or a bad control box. When you fix it, you should chase down all those possibilities and not let it leave the ground until you can do several full power ground runs.

[PropRocket]

xviper Thanks for the advice. I've been checking all the wires and connections just as I did after the first crash. During my first repair I found one of the pins on the lower strobe light loose because it was inserted incorrectly but I don't know what effect it would have had. None of the solder joints look bad but it's quite possible that any one of the small circuit devices that control the gear door timing, lighting, servo distribution could be faulty. Also, I did inspect the batteries on both flights mostly to make sure they weren't damaged from the crashes and they were both fine. I want to know what that tone I heard during the second takeoff was. That would help out a lot. I assume it was a low voltage alarm and I am going to try and duplicate it by running all 4 motors on a drained battery. If so, something is drawing too much current.

As for the BEC, I guess the 5.5V is trivial. I do know that the inboard flap servos should not be making the noises they're making and the rudder servo definitely strains more than is should because the servo control arm is not parallel with the rudder control arm and the rudder itself is a little stiff. Again, these may not be the problem but I was able to get one of the inboard flap servos to draw 900mA for almost 3 seconds just by cycling it past the limit of the flap. I did this on purpose just to see how much a strained servo could draw after reading about the door servo burning out or causing voltage sags because it was set up properly. It's definitely a weird problem but for my next flight I'm going to have a voltage and current measuring device (with it's own power source) record the current and voltage passing through power distribution wires.

[xviper]

When dealing with 4 engines and anytime a control board is added to the mix, a simple model can become a complex model and stuff can go wrong in all sorts of places.
Regarding the rudder, I too, noticed that the control arm was "off" so I put a slight "Z" bend in it to make it line up better with the horn. I can't remember exactly, but I think the rudder has a foam hinge and all foam hinges can be quite stiff out of the box. I remove the rods from these control surfaces and "exercise" the heck out of them before final calibration.
Just last week, on my C-130, on the last flight, both main gear doors stuck open. When I got it home and did the diagnosis, it turns out that both servos seized. Even in my hands, the arms would not budge - cheap components. Replaced both with other, better HobbyKing servos from dismantled planes and all is well.
This plane is great value for the money, but then, one has to wonder how many corners were cut to achieve that price point. I'm keeping my fingers crossed in hopes that nothing else bad turns up. I love the plane. Good luck with your diagnosis.

[tab28682]

I have had a couple of electric twins do the re-initialize thing on the ground or in the pits before flying.

In one case, it was a bad battery adapter, used so I could use some Deans equipped packs without changing out the stock aircraft plugs. One of the solder joints was broken in the adapter, which was the type that has the two types of connectors sold back to back. Stopped using adapters after that.

In the other case, years ago, it was a Deans connector I had overheated when I soldered it on a battery. Just damaged enough so it would sometimes lose contact for a moment.

As a poster mentioned, worth triple checking the wiring harness for the four ESCs. Also, I have seen models that would do the ESC reset if you picked them up and shook them, so worth trying that.


My C--130 is still doing great, but only have about 35 flights on it.

[PropRocket]

xviper Putting a z-bend in the rudder push rod is a good idea. I think that servo went bad as well. I was testing it yesterday and it was very jittery around the neutral position. I might as well change all the servos while I'm at it.

tab28682 I've been meticulously inspecting all the wiring. It's pretty easy with the plane in 3 pieces. I'm definitely going to hard wire all the servo connections that come out of the wing to a bypass the distribution board that came installed on it. I just don't like the rats nest of wires and each connection is a point of failure. I'm also going take a closer look at the XT-60 connector on the BEC. It doesn't have any visible problems but it's the first point of failure (besides the battery) in the power distribution circuit. Oh, I forgot to mention this, after my first crash I was inspecting the 4 power wires that come off the BEC and run through the wings. They have bullet connectors on them about a few inches passed the BEC and one of them was barely connected. I don't know if this happened during the crash but it would explain the first issue I had with the entire plane loosing power and resetting when it taxied. After that repair I had a new problem that seemed more like a low voltage condition.

I'll keep working and let everyone know if I find a smoking gun. Also, I'm working on a wiring schematic for the plane. I keep having to rely on pictures to remember how everything was connected and I've already mapped out the wing root connectors during an early round of troubleshooting so I figured it would come in handy if I keep having to rebuild this thing.