Alternative motor windings and drive schemes

[JKos]

Clugh,
I’m just trying to understand this thread. You are the only person posting to this thread. Yet, you seem to be replying to other people and posts that do not appear in this thread. That’s really confusing.

- John

[Clugh]

For now I also have these button 1 Farad 5.5 volts super caps. I was going to strap them directly across true EV cells but that was a while back and you need to use them as they have a shelf life to sit dormant. These will facilitate a heat sink mount like in the attachment.

Do you see Ralph!

Speed dial comes with members only attachments...

Es ist nur ein Rätsel für einen Idioten, der diese Agenten schickt.

Thanks for dropping buy ..and I hope the boys can implement some of this as "confusing" as it may be for some of us....🤣

Hubert

[Clugh]

Anyways photos are worth 1000 words. I'm going to use castle 8 awg for the connections. I use the castle because I know its pure copper not cheap higher resistance cca...

For the 1 farad buttons im looking for a balance charged array. There's no need to re engineer that as they are all over the place online. I just need to find one size and voltage appropriate. I guess you really could build them on 8 layer pcb's prepared by a board haus.

You can get them and similar supercap modules like this one which is 1.6 Farads at 16 volts. Not at all expensive either.

[Clugh]

Here are some traditional low ESR 100 volt 330uf electrolytics 125C* 🙈. I have a bag full of these. And long ago I guess 2012 I was interested in the supercap technology and my instructor at DTCC gave me a maxwell supercap D cell. This girl is 2.7 volts @ 350 farads. You can crank and drive a car with 4 or 5 of them and spot weld with one for a second at 945 amps . Id imagine the implications in power supplies enormous with the technology. Even for a test bench these would be a great addition to the bench power supply

I suppose someone could also build a rather robust 1-3s inverter with some of this super cap tech and the GaNFET technology available today.

Well let me stop rambling, start soldering, and see what charging these super caps looks like b4 my monolog of excitement spurs on another inquisition despite my 5000+ peeps and direct address here...


Let a man have a little fun. Be confused 😟 Life is stressful so sometimes its better that way...😉

TTYL
Hubert

[Clugh]

I put castle 6.5 mm on the 8 AWG leads for ease in different high current or voltage demands. Ill solder in 8 AWG receptacles in parallel with the battery imput leads of the esc because I don't think I can double load 8awg into the AMASS SH8.0 connectors and for the esc I soldered a par to the the esc's to match my delivery connection options of the SMC drag cells. They had the lowest ir. For low resistance connections the AMASS sh8.0 will easily load with 2x 10AWG wires so you could make clean parallel connections under the sheath of the connectors and eliminate heat shrink to hide the spice.

The jumpers you see on the pcb's are to safely discharge the capsThere are led indicators to let you know the bank is fully spent and also if an individual cap or caps is damaged. If they get damage ETTI request you send it back for repair.

[Clugh]

Good morning!

I see everyone is up before me today... I always check...😀

It will go something like this. Since everything is potted. I think I could just print hard cases in HTPLA with water inlets and outlets and the plugs locked into the case. Basically a full submersion other than the led display panel and discharge jumper. If I print the case to the exact dimensions of the lower PCB I could created a sealed lip there and it would work. You could have also tabbed the banks with a strips of real copper then bring them out of the case at right angles so you could mount the cased caps then solder the power wire to length and very neatly. What I do not want is spaghetti all over the place. I want the wiring secured well managed and consolidated throughout the FE vehicles. You may even see some chokes in there if the lines happen to get too long. This is another thing an Hybrid wind helps with. The wye coils act like embedded load reactors so that helps with reflections along long lines. How relevant that is at the wire lengths we see in hobby is a question but at least the proven theory exist as reasoning to implement it. At least then you know some type of reflection and spike mitigation is already in place regardless. If you are here Ill assume you know a little about electronics and how load reactors work with motors and drives...

But just in case a motor winding "guru" does not...





and that's a damn shame if you tune power systems and do not know it about the latest wind proposals in the industry and what benefits they bring....

[Clugh]

[Clugh]

[Clugh]

And I hope all the winding experts there note in copper loss that despite the benefit in a conventional wye machine that a lower DC resistance is NOT always the winner! Hybrids, interspersed, and >1 coils span semi concentrated windings will in inherently have longer end turns than a FSCW with a coil span of 1 Duh! So what? Measured resistance will be higher. 😱 The "BLDC" motors especially wyes are still working pseudo AC! Right????

So in operation wouldn't this mean AC resistance to change of current direction like skin and proximity effect weigh more in efficiency and power factor than the stalled dc?? You in here for a daily lesson...so here you go....😜

Borat,
You and I know between us It is nothing new or proprietary in academic circles. I've told you and your winding friends in Germany years ago!

You buried the Gerling/Gurakuq 7/8 from the hobbyist and never tested it correctly for its benefit!!

[Clugh]

If I think of a motor coils in terms of an inductor . Inductors with more turns are higher Q.

The Q factor .... the winding resistance in series with the inductor happens to dissipate the REACTIVE ENERGY . the quality factor or Q of an inductor is the ratio of its inductive reactance to its resistance at any given frequency and is a measure of its efficiency. The higher the Q factor inductor approaches the ideal inductor. The higher q inductor also has a narrower resonant bandwidth. Noise wise that should definitely be less to deal with holistically. I don't want to just come out and say it but it all suggest generally speaking that more turns are better for efficiency as a whole anyway.

What do and your silent friends here correlate there on Gerds social media in Germany about exclusively the low dc resistance Ralph?



Anyway I have work to do. Talk to you later cap.
Hubert

[Clugh]

(Dr Okon, Borat, Powercroco,BOHO1) 😆
Q steigt linear mit der Frequenz, wenn L und R konstant sind. Obwohl sie bei niedrigen Frequenzen konstant sind, variieren die Parameter mit der Frequenz. Beispielsweise erhöhen Skin-Effekt, Proximity-Effekt und Kernverluste R mit der Frequenz; Wicklungskapazität und Schwankungen der Permeabilität mit der Frequenz beeinflussen L.

Bei niedrigen Frequenzen und innerhalb bestimmter Grenzen verbessert (oder erhöht) die Erhöhung der Windungszahl N den Q-Wert, da L mit N2 variiert, während R linear mit N variiert. Ebenso verbessert (oder erhöht) die Erhöhung des Radius r eines Induktors den Q-Wert, da L mit r2 variiert, während R linear variiert mit r. Daher haben Luftkerninduktoren mit hohem Q oft große Durchmesser und viele Windungen. Bei beiden Beispielen wird davon ausgegangen, dass der Durchmesser des Drahts gleich bleibt, sodass in beiden Beispielen proportional mehr Draht verwendet wird. Wenn die Gesamtmasse des Drahtes konstant gehalten wird, hätte eine Erhöhung der Windungszahl oder des Windungsradius keinen Vorteil, da der Draht proportional dünner sein müsste.

Die Verwendung eines ferromagnetischen Kerns mit hoher Permeabilität kann die Induktivität bei gleicher Kupfermenge erheblich erhöhen, sodass der Kern auch den Q-Wert erhöhen kann. Kerne verursachen jedoch auch Verluste, die mit der Frequenz zunehmen. Das Kernmaterial wird für beste Ergebnisse für das Frequenzband ausgewählt. Induktivitäten mit hohem Q müssen eine Sättigung vermeiden; Eine Möglichkeit ist die Verwendung eines (physikalisch größeren) Luftkerninduktors. Bei VHF oder höheren Frequenzen wird wahrscheinlich ein Luftkern verwendet. Ein gut konstruierter Luftkerninduktor kann einen Q-Wert von mehreren Hundert haben.
~wiki~

Basically you want more copper but in more turns .....

Bi Bi
Hubert.

[Clugh]

Hi
Remember these girls from early in the thread?

https://www.hobbysquawk.com/forum/electronics-and-rc-accessories/power-system-components/386348-alternative-motor-windings-and-drive-schemes?p=386380#post386380

They come with 7WG! and I opted they come to my door with the AMASS SH 8.0. These things can probably take 4 awg. but definitely dual 10 awg the approximation of 7 awg. Im running 4 cell packs so I need a serial plug for the packs for higher voltages. On all my high current ill use the AMASS like these. They really out perform the EC8 . A large iron high wattage iron helps 😠 I use the Leponitt 100 watt iron. I haven't purchase the Rheostat for it yet but plan to. That will definitely extend the life of the tip. For long periods I just unplug it for now.🖕

[Clugh]

I can run 8 s at 10600 mah and 250C no issue but in the end I'm crazy for the power of the the drag cells so for my pleasure ill buy 2 more series them and parallel them together for 8s lipo 21,200 mah @ 250C or 16s lipo10,600 mah @ 250C . JAGS knows that should be enough juice to cook plenty of wunderbar, crocodile, and the monkey in Bayern that rode in on his back.

We can gather around the pool for the cookout and drink lager off the 80's lap cat with the "visually brutal" "outboards".....



Danke,
Hubert

[Clugh]

Wrap Pyro 650 to 6S or from 620U/V to approx. 1000U/V | RC-Network.de

Not even worth my time 🤡

[Clugh]

Sorry Ralph... I didn't see any new pyro configurations in your strategically planted thread everyone hadn't already done yet. You should post the old PYRO 650 wind information on Helifreaks...

None of that's proprietary..



Nice plant but...
Nur ein Idiot denkt an den Zufall. Sie werden nie wissen, welchen Kuchen wir backen, bis es an der Zeit ist, Kuchen zu kaufen.

You see the 22x20 counter rotational props are here in the Research Triangle Park area North Carolina with me for load testing.

The subliminal plug is too subtle and no one can follow that but me. You see we have confused ones already 😏. Be direct and ask may you wind it...

Submit something if you'd like we will definitely compare it



Regards
Hubert

[Clugh]

GOOD MORNING speed dial ....😀

Ich sehe, ich habe Sie dazu inspiriert, wieder aufzubauen und wieder ganz oben auf den deutschen Social-Media-Seiten zu stehen, aber es ist immer noch das Gleiche von der alten Drehbank. Elektronisch ist es das gleiche alte herkömmliche Delta oder YY und es wird immer noch mit einem DUMM-Wechselrichter betrieben. Probieren Sie mal etwas Neues wie einen eingebetteten Antrieb mit kurzen Strompfaden, einen FOC-DSP-basierten Algorithmus mit GaNFet- oder SiCFet-Technologie, wenn Sie führend sind. Du veralteter Bruder...

RC Power Boats and Ships - Hobby Squawk RC Forum for Airplanes, Boats, Cars, Helicopters, Tanks, and Trucks

Peek a boo I see you...


I am not at all "confused" . You'll stalk and follow my work until I am dead.


YT
Hubert

[Clugh]

[Clugh]

Lets watch it again powercroco and all your friends because that silly ass YGE from early 2000 hasn't a clue what prop its turning or its DYNAMIC load. You can put that old 16khz brick with old turnigy brains on the shelf in a museum where it belongs. I dont have an inverter in my collection that wont do at least 32Khz and everyone of them have a lower internal resistance...

[Clugh]

Viewing Who's Online
Boho1
Today, 06:18 PM

Looks like I may have a few accomplished pilots that are looking for an edge Ralph. What's nice is they can test many ideas for pilots empirically while I stay In the lab.

Wonder if one of them would have interest in flying the speed plane Chris said I could not build. The boys are wonderful at 3d modeling so I can tell them what I want for wing profiles and an airframe and print a plug .....

Like Chris said

The Americans are building...

[Clugh]

B.Sharp

Ill let you know...the spy is sitting one the wall here 247 365 ready to take any good ideas implement them and definitely not give credit. Let me show you an example...

Do you see these flat wires coming out of the scorpion not connected to the esc? Those are the wye bundle or pigtails for the YY winds that would be normally twisted. Now for his life he has always tucked the pigtails underneath the hood with the phase wires end turns, the hottest part of the windings typically. The only part that would surely be hotter is the pigtails in a wyes bundle as they can see 300% of the phase currents. I suggest years ago to bring them straight out of the motor to radiate heat away from the toque responsible windings and keep the winding temps down which only raise the resistance and lower the efficiency. 😱 Copper and silver solder are going to have excellent thermal conductivity, so in and of themselves they make a great heatsink TWISTED and out in open air. The reason you twist is so equal parts or alll 3 wire see air equally at the most external parts of the bundles. When u do 3 in a line the wire in the middle is hotter than the outsides so a higher resistance there than anything you measure on the milliohm meter at room temperature .🙊 Next thing you know there or here it is incorrectly implemented on the German Social media a marvel no one can touch on taken right out of HUBERT'S tuning books 😲teamed here with the fancy 320 with skinny buss bars added to make it a YGE400. On the forums do you think I get credit from the east coast "gurus" ?

See how much capacitance is on it...


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