Official Freewing 64mm F-14 Tomcat Twin 64mm EDF Jet Thread

[Chris_WaterGuy]

Well, the F14 was stocked in the EU warehouse for not much longer than a day before selling out! Does anyone have any idea before they’ll be restocked?
thanks

[Kaos]

I received my F-14 64mm on Friday and I now have it assembled and setup. Everything works as expected including thrust reverse and gyro (in the correct directions) 🤪. The only problem I’m experiencing is elevator to flap mixing. In my ix-14 I tried the default ELE-FLAP mix and no joy - no trim movement. Next, I tried creating my own mix and still no joy. In both cases I applied the mix to my desired Flap switch D. Maybe this has something to do with the Freewing mixing board? Not a show stopper, but I would like to have that adjustment available. I know some don’t use it or feel they need it; just a personal preference.

As an aside, I decided to order the ARF-Plus version since the PNP was out-of-stock. I added two 64mm fan units and dual 60A ESC, all from the parts replacement list. It all went together very nicely. And of course I paid a little more doing it this way. Still, I’m happy with what I see so far and am looking forward to the maiden. I see tons of good reviews. 👍

[Kaos]

I figured out my flap to elevator mix problem. I was using Elevator Flap instead of Flap to Elevator. Doh! 🤣🤪

[thedarkwraith]

Out at our grass field here in Northern IL the F-14 does well. Our field is not the best for flatness (very bumpy) but we do keep the grass short. I've had no issues with takeoffs or landings and the gear seems to be taking it fine. I have 5 flights on the plane but have not swept the swings back for a couple of reasons:
1) with wings swept back the ailerons are still active. I can't find a way to disable them when swept back without using another channel on the RX, wiring straight to ailerons, and using mixing.
2) when checking CG with wings swept back it moves considerably aft. I don't trust the included gyro in the plane yet so if anyone can tell me how much elevator is required for level flight after sweeping wings back I would be willing to give it a try.

Where do I find the Freewing Blue Bridge to connect to the gyro? I've done a google search but came up with nothing.

The RX I'm using in the plane is a Spektrum AR10100T. I do not have the reverse thrust connected at this time. I did make a connector for monitoring pack voltage by taking a 7 pin male balance lead connector and removing the 5 inside wires (thus leaving the 2 outside wires on the connector) and soldered that to the 2 pin battery lead included with the RX. Plugged that into the 2 pin VOLT port on RX and setup iX20 to tell me when pack voltage at 3.6VPC (which announces Land Warning) and when pack voltage at 3.5VPC (which announces Land Now) so that I can get max flying time out of my battery packs. In order to make that RX 'fit' I had to remove material under the canopy. Not a big deal but you should be aware if you are going to use the same or similar RX and mount it forward of the battery compartment between it and the nosewheel steering servo.

I think the plane is nice but the wing sweep servos seem a little under powered as the wings won't quite sweep all the way forward when swept back. Looking for replacements at the moment but so far no contenders.

I did purchase some 6200mah racing batteries (90C 180C burst) from CNHL for the plane and while they do fit I'm unable to get the CG in spec with them. I believe after acquiring the afterburners and installing them I should be able to get CG in spec. The batteries I'm currently using are HRB 5200mah 100C. I get about 3 1/2 minutes flying time (half to 3/4 throttle) before I have to land. Upon landing I'm down to 15-20%.

The 5 flights I have on the plane were all on relatively windy days with winds 5-10mph with gusts up to 15. I had no problems controlling or landing with those winds (I don't use the gyro as mentioned earlier). I used full flaps on those landings and as long as you watch your speed you don't float considerably (power at about 10-20% on landing). Once the plane was close to the ground and leveled out I would cut the power and just let it slowly sink while using elevator to control the sink rate. The tires used on main and nosewheel are extremely hard and not suitable for grass ops. I will be looking for replacements. If anyone has any suggestions that would be great.

In the building of the plane I did not like some of the design considerations that were made. I changed the wing pivot nuts to nylon insert ones. They used flush mount screws in non-flush mount locations and I changed them to hex head with washers (4 total). Very important you check all the screws in the wing support and wing sweep mechanisms for locktite as mine had NO loctite on any of them! The elevator rods that mount into the fuse have NO flat spots on them so I made my own flatspots to ensure they won't come out.

[thedarkwraith]

Looking at the weather for this coming Wed shows warm temps (60s) and low winds (4-6mph) so I decided to setup the F-14 for separate ailerons (on it's own channel and ability to not be tied to elevators). I will describe what I did in case anyone is wondering how it could be done:

As I mentioned I'm using an AR10100T 10 channel RX. I setup CH9 (Aux4) as the aileron channel and ran a wire back to the control board. On that wire I put a Y connector and removed both ailerons from the control board and attached them to the Y. Both Aileron servos are normal (one isn't reversed) so this could be done. In the iX20 I setup switch E to be the master aileron enable (switch up aileron master enabled and switch down aileron master disabled). The reason for this master aileron enable is so that I can totally disable the ailerons if I want to. A logical switch was made and called Aileron logic (logic switch 2 for me as logic switch 1 I have used already). The two inputs into the logic switch were wing sweep (switch D2 - this is how I have my wing sweep setup - switch up is wings out and switch down is wings in) and master aileron enable (switch E). The output of the logic switch was set to 100% ONLY if master aileron enable is enabled (switch E is up) AND wings were swept out (switch D2 is up). Then I setup a mix that took AIL as input and Aux4 as output (regular mix no curve). Trim was disabled in the mix (my personal preference but you could enable if you wanted to) so that any trim on the aileron channel only goes to the elevators. The controlling switch for the mix is Aileron logic (logic switch 2 for me). Rates were both set to 100%. Curve was set to 0. With all this if either switch D2 or E is not up ailerons are disabled. I had to reverse Aux4 channel as my ailerons were moving in the wrong direction. The only thing I wish I could do is set a delay in the logic when ailerons are enabled. Reason being if wings are swept back and master aileron is enabled and you sweep wings forward (D2 up) the ailerons immediately become active even though the wings are swept back but moving to the swept out position. I wish I could also set a speed so that when the ailerons become active they slowly move to the commanded position (if you have aileron input with wings swept back then elevons are only active but once you flip D2 up the ailerons immediately become active and your roll rate could be severe) to avoid abrupt changes in roll rate. That was all the logic needed to separate the ailerons and be able to disable them when wings swept back. Because the ailerons are now on their own channel (9 - Aux4) you can do some creative things with them like spoilers or adding washout during high alpha maneuvers.

I also added some voice alerts. I added voice alerts to switch E, D2, and aileron logic (logic switch 2) to give me audible feedback on those switch changes.

I will be adding another mix tomorrow that will use the left top trim to trim the elevator when the wings are swept back to counteract the aft CG movement with the wings swept back. This will allow me to trim the aircraft in flight with the wings swept back and this trim will only be active when the wings are swept back.

[Yellowred]

Well, the F14 was stocked in the EU warehouse for not much longer than a day before selling out! Does anyone have any idea before they’ll be restocked?
thanks

Chris, I have one that was ordered for me as a birthday present and has just arrived, its not very practical for my flying site so I would sell it at cost if you were interested? I could post it as its still in Original unopened box,

[Chris_WaterGuy]

Chris, I have one that was ordered for me as a birthday present and has just arrived, it’s not very practical for my flying site so I would sell it at cost if you were interested? I could post it as its still in Original unopened box,

Hi Yellow Red. I’ve P.M’d you, thanks

[thedarkwraith]

Today was not a good day for the F-14. Had a total of 4 flights on her today and the 4th was disaster.

First flight of the day was done with wings swept out as I was still getting her trimmed out to my liking. Second flight I finally swept the wings back and to my surprise there was hardly any CG shift (gyro off). At most it wanted to slightly climb which was no big deal. I flew most of that flight with the wings swept back. Third flight was just having fun with the F-14 trying rolls with wings swept and wings out (still gyro off). Fourth flight I departed into the wind (~5mph) and started a shallow climb. Rolled out to the right and once wings were level and I had a little more altitude I swept the wings back. Here is where things went very bad. Immediately the F-14 started a fast roll to the left and full right aileron would just get it to roll back to the right slowly. The plane also had a hard time maintaining level flight - I was totally overloaded with trying to keep the thing stable in the air. Eventually it dove and rolled left and impacted the ground. From the wreckage it appears to hit slightly banked to the right and slightly nose down. The aft top part of the plane from behind the wings was in good shape (underside was destroyed) and the whole front section was a total loss. The left wing was still connected with minimal damage BUT the flap was totally disconnected from the wing but still connected to the servo (aileron still connected). Right wing was removed from the plane and basically sheared off at the pivot and flap and aileron still connected.

A close inspection of the left wing shows that there was minimal glue on the hinges and the flap broke free from all 3 hinges. This is what was probably causing the fast roll to the left since it was still 'connected' to the plane by the pushrod. Pictures of the wreckage and video of that 4th flight coming tomorrow (person who shot the video has to upload it still).

This appears to be a manufacturing defect. Lets see how Motion RC stands behind their products.

I would advise removing your flap hinges from wing and flap, reglue, and pin them to ensure they cannot come off. There was hardly any glue on any of the hinges and little to no foam was lifted.

[Coconut]

What do you mean by pinning the flap hinges?

[Madspadder]

Thedarkwrairh is an excellent pilot flying with the best equipment. Pretty sure we can rule out pilot error. I will post a link to the video once it is uploaded. I tried to zoom in to show how one wing was swept and the orher wasn't. Definitely hope that Motion looks into this. Too nice of a jet to have problems like this after a couple of flights. He absolutely loved this plane until it developed problems.

[kallend]

What do you mean by pinning the flap hinges?

You are the second person I've heard report flap hinge problems, and I had one stabilator (elevator) that had almost no adhesive on the plastic part that the horn screws into.

Glue must be expensive in China.

[f4u ausie]

For what it's worth.. I've noticed less glue. Not on this .. landing gear on spitfire. Almost none. Came loose after first landing.. f4 phantom wood blocks for edf mount. Were loose. Out of the box i mean . Not glued at all.
sure they will fix it.. .... Check check. Everything B4 first flights

[Madspadder]

Here is a video of thedarkwraith's last flight. Such a great looking and flying jet until the problems developed.

https://youtu.be/yABV9zN_oBE?si=B7PHSE2E-_V0-9LU

[Chris_WaterGuy]

For what it's worth.. I've noticed less glue. Not on this .. landing gear on spitfire. Almost none. Came loose after first landing.. f4 phantom wood blocks for edf mount. Were loose. Out of the box i mean . Not glued at all.
sure they will fix it.. .... Check check. Everything B4 first flights

I have 3 Freewing EDF Jet models thus far and hoping this F14 will be my fourth.

I had flap hinges detach on my HSD Viper several years ago during the approach resulting in an un-commanded roll into the deck!
Since then I have routinely firmly tugged on the control surfaces / hinges and linkages of new models, often resulting in movement. So now I routinely re-attach all hinges with Foam-Tac or UHU-pore glue.

Of more concern to me is the detachment of the wing sweep pushrods in darkwraith's model. The pushrods look like they attach to the servo arms via ball links. Is this correct? In which case should they be replaced and if so, what would anyone recommend?

[f4u ausie]

I don't hav this plane yet. I will.......... I've seen 2 u tube vids so far crashes. . implying 1 wing swept only... But way more happy chappy's vids that is. Get with the program.. u pay for and assemble yourself. A thing u then put in the air...mmm. Risky on its own. Ask ramy RC how much his planes cost..
Just sayin. Hopeing I'm not outta line.. just hate the it's somebody elses fault world

[Madspadder]

I agree that 90% of the time it's pilot error or not setting up the plane properly. In my opinon, in this case the flap hinges were defimitely a manufacturer's issue. Flap hinges shpuld not fail after a few flights and are not part of assembly or set up. Just my two cents worth.🙂

[thedarkwraith]

I know people will think that I caused the problem and want the manufacturer to replace my mistake but that is not the case. Watch the video and you will see that I had full control of the plane until the wings swept back. I had 6 successful flights on the plane with 2 of those that same day sweeping the wings back. In the video when the plane was heading away from the field with the wings swept back I tried sweeping the wings back out and nothing happened then I tried turning on the gyro to see if it could assist in controlling the plane and it couldn't. That was right before it rolled and started diving to the ground. You can see the wings moving around a couple of times in the video denoting that the pushrods for the wing sweep came off. How did they come off? Got me but when I tried sweeping them out and nothing happened in flight I knew there was a problem.

Post crash inspection shows that both wing sweep pushrods were in fact not attached to the servos. I will post many pictures of the after crash inspection. Some will say they popped off during the crash. I have to say no to that based on the wing sweep mechanisms are still attached to the wing box and there is no indication that the wings tried to force themselves into the aft body (see pictures). The left flap is suspiciously disconnected from the hinges and was wedged between the wing and aft body (aileron still attached and if you look at the pictures there is no damage to wing or flap to show that it was crash damage that ripped if off) and right wing has both flap and aileron still attached even though it sheared off at the pivot point. The pictures are the best evidence I have to show the failures incurred.

The wing sweep pushrods should be some kind of captured ball link or some kind of ball link that you have to unscrew to remove it. These plastic ball links that just push on seem a little like a cost savings measure to me in such a critical area as the wing sweep mechanisms.

[thedarkwraith]

Forgot to mention that in the picture showing the wing box you can see the wing sweep servos were in the swept out position. In the video you can clearly see the wings are swept back so the pushrods had to have popped off once I swept the wings back. If you look closely in the video you can see instances where the wings were moving for/aft uncontrolled in turns.

[thedarkwraith]

By pinning I mean drilling a small hole through the hinge and whatever it attaches to and inserting a small diameter carbon fiber rod into the hole with glue (cut to length of course). That way the hinge is less likely to rip off perpendicular to the carbon rod.

They have nice hinges installed on the ailerons but put cost saving measures (in my opinion) hinges on the flaps. Look at the missing RIO there is a bean counter saying we can save $x dollars by not installing it (even though holes are there for it).

[Hugh Wiedman]

For what it's worth.. I've noticed less glue. Not on this .. landing gear on spitfire. Almost none. Came loose after first landing.. f4 phantom wood blocks for edf mount. Were loose. Out of the box i mean . Not glued at all.
sure they will fix it.. .... Check check. Everything B4 first flights

I had the exact same issue on the new 8S F4 I just turned into the Jolly Rodgers: Absolutely no glue on the wood blocks for the edf mount!! When I took out the edf to install the afterburners, the fan almost fell out in my lap! Definitely averted a real problem there as the wood blocks are not recessed in the foam and there is nothing preventing the whole thing from moving forward, except the foam around the outer edge of the fan casing-maybe enough to sort of keep it from rocketing through the fuse up to the nose at full power! That would be a real shock to the pilots when the fan blew through the nose in front of them.