Freewing 90mm F-22 Raptor - Official Thread

[C17loadmaster]

I wish I was smart like Bojora. He's lucky to get cool stuff . I wish I could fly Motion planes before they come out. I can barely support my life

Join the military...

[Alpha]

Hi all,
I am strongly considering the ARF+ version, but have two options for power systems that I already have from other projects. The problem is I don't know how either will perform in this airframe so I am also considering just going with the pnp version. Any advice? I have a Freewing 8s edf 4075-1250kV 12 blade system I originally thought I wanted to use but the pnp version of this bird uses a 1390kv. So I'm worried I won't get the top speed out of it that I would from the pnp version. Then I also have a freewing 12 blade 6s system with 4068-1680kv inrunner. How would this compare against the pnp 9 blade setup? I really don't want to kill packs or sub 3 minute flight times just chasing top speed, but also don't want sub par performance to the stock 9 blade which looks like a great all around performance setup.

Thanks!
J

Welcome home to Hobby Squawk, J!

I'd normally recommend getting the 6s PNP, but since you already have two power systems, I think buying the cheaper ARF Plus makes more sense for your wallet. Your 4068-1680kv inrunner will be a good setup in this F-22. Your older 8s setup will be good, too. I've flown both. As I've mentioned before in this thread, the F-22 can be flown in such a way that the 10% difference in 8s motor kv won't be that noticeable in the air. I'd also encourage against chasing pure speed in the F-22. It's large lifting surfaces make it optimized for a wider flight envelope than simply going fast in a straight line.

I think you'll be happy with the cheaper ARF Plus because you could test both of your power systems and decide for yourself which you prefer according to your personal flying style and flight goals.

[Alpha]

Oh great.....F22. Is it grass operated like F4?

Yes, the F-22 can operate on short grass fields like the F-4. The F-22's taller single nose wheel cuts through grass easier than the F-4's smaller double wheel, while the F-4's main wheels give a wider stance than the F-22's narrower main wheels.

You can see a takeoff and landing on grass at the end of the flight review video that James posted earlier:

Bajora, thanks for posting those photos! Your photos show off the subtle shading gradients and different tones of the various decals. Difficult to describe in writing, but the net result to the human eye is more depth and realism.

[RuthR720]

Thank you for advancing the hobby MotionRC! I'm looking forward to flying the 8S F-22! I'll need more straps to hang this gorgeous jet. I sew d-rings onto straps and hang them on a hook. I use padding around the leading edge on my heavier aircraft. Your company sells transmitter and keychain lanyards. We need padded aircraft lanyards with a quick release to display these fine aircraft please. Yellow wheel chocks would be great also because my walls get dirty from the wheels.

[purduephigam]

Thank you for advancing the hobby MotionRC! I’m looking forward to flying the 8S F-22! I’ll need more straps to hang this gorgeous jet. I sew d-rings onto straps and hang them on a hook. I use padding around the leading edge on my heavier aircraft. Your company sells transmitter and keychain lanyards. We need padded aircraft lanyards with a quick release to display these fine aircraft please. Yellow wheel chocks would be great also because my walls get dirty from the wheels.

That's a pretty sweet man cave right there!

[Mike_Then]

So what does the 'roller' do?

[fieldofdreamsflyer]

Join the military...

To old and bad back

[sailing1]

Pre ordered the 8s version. What batteries are recommended?

[Pete Lane]

So what does the 'roller' do?

When the wheel meets the upper well, they ensure that the wheel rim and tire don't scrub the surface as the strut shoulder joint moves upon compression at the very end of its up cycle.This assures that the cycle is trouble free with zero binding. Really cool stand off feature. Would also allow clearance for any mud or grass bits that may cling to the rotating wheel assembly. It also helps alleviate confusion with the retracts micro switch as on other systems you can really hear them over compress the wheel in the well. This can tax both the retract motor and BEC needlessly.

Its Kind off like sliding home on your buns ;)

Please see it in action at 15:15 in the provided link.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vPbQq3jJrak

Pete

[Tom]

Pre ordered the 8s version. What batteries are recommended?

for 8S, you will want two batteries. The Admiral 5000 6S and the Admiral 5000 2S in combination with a series adapter. The EC5 series adapter can be found here: https://www.motionrc.com/collections...series-adapter

Link to 5000 6s: https://www.motionrc.com/collections...-ec5-connector
Link to 5000 2s: https://www.motionrc.com/collections...ttery-with-ec5

The 6S and 2S 5000 have the exact same cells. They were made to work together.

[JLambCWU]

We received one today as a review project to appear in Model Aviation Magazine ... we snuck a quick look at it and shot a few out of the box close-up photos that show the paint scheme and various features:

Could we get you to measure out the dimensions of the exhaust nozzles on a small diagram and get the exhaust opening measurements as well?

I’m sure others like myself would appreciate it.

thanks!

J

[Flanker271]

Does Motion carry EC5 to Deans (T-type) adapter? I only see EC3 to Deans adapter, but not EC5 to Deans. My entire fleet use Deans Ultra plugs.

[Jayf636]

Thanks for the advice all! I think I'm going to pick up the ARF version and give my 8s system a try! I'm hoping the additional weight of the battery and esc dont degrade performance. If so I can rip it out and try it on the 6s 12 blade unit .

[James]

Does Motion carry EC5 to Deans (T-type) adapter? I only see EC3 to Deans adapter, but not EC5 to Deans. My entire fleet use Deans Ultra plugs.

We do not carry a connector like that. Quick search on google shows some offer it, but it really comes to amp draw being a potential issue. Last year I was flying my Mig-21 and had an older 6s lipo with a deans, so I had soldered up an adaptor for it (deans to ec5) on my second flight my motor shut off mid fast pass. Aircraft managed to have minimal damage as it magically continued straight losing speed and belly landed on some lush grass. But opening up the canopy saw my adaptor was fried. Now I can't say if it was my soldering job or not, but I definitely lost trust in that combination as the larger connectors can handle larger AMP draws. More and more dean's are being phased out for EC3's and 5's and XT 30's, 60's and 90's. So all I can say is I'd suggest avoiding that setup if possible. Someone else can chime in and tell me if I should be fearful of it or not, but just my opinion on the subject. If you are comfortable with soldering it isn't hard to change the connectors of LiPo's and "upgrading" them for minimal cost.

[Flanker271]

Thanks for the info James. I've been using Deans for over a decade and it'll be a pain to swap everything to another connector type. I've actually converted many Admiral batteries to Deans, just so that I don't need to mess with adapters. Seeing the F-22, there are UBEC wires in conjunction with the ESC power wire coming out of the EC5 connector, it will be a hassle to solder them on Deans, which is why I asked if an adapter is available.

I don't really trust those online adapters from eBay or Amazon, because the Deans plug they use are not genuine W.S. Deans Ultra plugs, hence the amperage rating might not be on par with the genuine Deans. I also don't trust their soldering job.

So far I've not had any issues with using genuine Deans. One of my F5B hotliner pulls 175amp (4 second burst) and it seems to hold up fine.

If I were to do it all over again, yes I'll definitely use newer plugs. It's just a massive pain to swap everything out now.

P.S. one of the guys at my field carries a giant plastic box (the kind that you use to organize various fishing baits) full of adapters. EC3 to XT-60, EC3 to EC5 (still don't know why he even bothered with this), Tamiya to Traxxas, Anderson Power Pole to Deans, etc. Then multiply that by four to cover all the male/female combinations. What a giant mess.

[Tom]

James, you are right on. An EC5 can handle a LOT more current than a T connector. I purposely avoided adding an EC5 to T connector adapter to motionrc.com because of the massive potential to bring down a plane. A T connector will melt and potentially start on fire at a current draw an EC5 is perfectly comfortable with. Using a T connector on something like this F-22 will, with near 100% certainty, cause the T connector to melt and the plane to fall to the ground powerless. I know this first hand because we had a customer try it on the Freewing ME-262 a number of years back. The customer cut off the EC5 and soldered on T connectors. The T connectors melted about 30 seconds into the flight and the plane lost power and ended up in the ground. On the other hand, we do have an EC3 to T connector adapter because they both handle similar levels of current.

[Twowingtj]

I concur with James' advice, I've been flying high volt high amp birds for a number of years(up to 100cc elec). For Deans, I draw the line at 75 amps. Many will disagree, I'm sure.

Think of your connector as the neck of a funnel. The smaller the neck, the less will go through unrestricted. If a funnel backs up you have a mess on your hands. With electricity, that restriction causes resistance, resulting in heat, reduced performance and often component failure. Flying our aircraft with those conditions rarely ends well. In the case of larger EDFs, large good quality connectors are always a better choice.

[JamesonC]

I love deans for 3s/4s applications but use nothing but EC5 for anything 6s. I understand that the amps matter, not voltage, but all my high amp draw setups are all 6s anyway!

[andrew_flyguy]

Flanker, I HIGHLY recommend dropping the Deans for 6S applications and moving to XT90. All my 6S is on XT90 and I've had 0 issues. They're SUPER easy to solder (trying to get those EC5s in the housing has driven me nuts before) and keep neat.

One flying buddy of mine USED TO fly 6S jets on XT60 until a month or so back, when his leads came unsoldered from the connector due to high amp draw during a flight. Maybe it was a cold soldering job, but still... 60s are not designed for draw over 60 amps. Same for Deans - and I believe they're only designed for up to 50 amp draw. Another buddy of mine flies 6S warbirds on Deans... and I think it's only a matter of time until he encounters the same issue as that other friend I mentioned.

I'll keep preaching the XT90 gospel. They're super easy to deal with.

[Flanker271]

Thanks for all the inputs guys, it sounded like I'm screwed:Crying:. My entire fleet of 14 planes and 22 batteries all use Deans. Most of them are 6S applications. Time to convert some of the planes that I most cared about into EC5.