Alternative motor windings and drive schemes

[Clugh]

Its always someone else's fault when geniuses have no innovation. This would passively pump cool fluid directly to the airgap of a sealed motor thru flussperren channels. That would increase the thermal conductivity from the winding and iron to exterior the bell as much as 400 percent. You could fasten a fluid filled heatsink to the top of a bridge with pyrolytic graphite between..

[Clugh]

A genius would turn back around and cryogenically charge the heat sink for a short duration
This was only -29C in a 2 sec spray duration of a proprietary gas compound.

[Clugh]

The gas compound can fit in a small Robart gas retractable landing gear gas reservoir system. And be charged accordingly.... get yourself together player...

Dont hate..... Innovate!🤪

[Clugh]

"Im wesentlichen ist die Reparatur geschafft.
Ob das am Ende für die ominösen "echten" 600 reicht? Die Messtrecke wird es erst in 2024 zeigen können.?"


I doubt very seriously it will happen if it hadn't happened yet when nothing has really changed Borat. It is a conventional wye wind that has more than two large strands per phase and since these strands are not twisted and are stacked axially versus radially the currents are different in the two wires at every point in the slot. One wire is always more current dense than the other.... Not as bad as the bi filar delta but the AC crosstalk is still there. Then you have 300% of the phase current tightly tucked under the hood with the end turns. It would be interesting to see a FLIR shot of the motor in operation. It would always be better to let them hang out and away from the end turns and radiate to open air. It will only be slightly better than the single wire parallel delta counterpart with the BLAC 320 Ampere inverter. It is very doubtful that difference will be significant enough to do much more. The 320 can only peak 460 amperes and it is the antiquated inverter from YGE. At a glance the 255 opto is the modern offering with higher PWM capabilities which will help with a low induction machine. With the YGE 320 31.2 kW is the peak limit (with adequate airflow) no specific amount given. With the 16S APD it is 40.8kW with 10 m/s of airflow. The first limit is the inverter because if you wind a motor that has a lower resistance than the inverter it is the limiter no matter what. In a scenario like that you cant extract full power with the inverter anyway. You can stamp Germany all over it butt the YGE's internal resistances is still 20-25% higher than everybody else regardless.. 🙈🙉🙊

[Clugh]

BTW This is an acceptable way to look at an Inverters efficiency. U do not do it with comparative data logs from the different inverters...
A quality 3 phase power analyzer will require more "donations" to the animal shelter....

[Clugh]

To talk the talk social media really needs one.

[Clugh]

"Yes, with the new gimmicks such as current limitation and very high (not adjustable) sample rates plus automatic maximum value display, you can get a lot of (apparent) performance out of it for the consumer.
However, if you know the propeller diagram and Kai's log with the same battery, motor, propeller, you know quite well what power has probably been effectively applied to the speed.

If a 400A regulator needs special software to regulate at 400A peak (not effective) but is labeled and advertised with this amperage, and it does this in the delivery state already at 250A and can be set to a maximum of 300A peak with the supplied software, everyone can call something like that how they feel about it.

And now, as Oli already said and especially the Schmiddie always demands in "his" threads:"

Borat you really should be ashamed for the fact the post show a few problems.

1. if it was set at the default 250 how did he manage 280?
2. if it was set at 250 that also means you haven not figure out how to use the configurator properly yet.
3. Ohms law would dictate choosing the right inverter for the job since you keep making general statements about the better inverter you clearly still are not aware specification are model specific. Its quite tragic you only get 280 when 600 is available at a yge320's max voltage level.
4. If its the higher voltage model Why doesn't you wind utilize lower Kv with higher voltage in which it would make more power at higher efficiency with less amperage??

It is nothing but user error when you select the wrong inverter for the application and do not know how to configure it. THERE IS A MANUAL. Your reports from the modelers that sit on RGC and ask ump Tillion questions about set up of the inverter and still get it wrong is stellar reporting. Your inaccurate post help to facilitate further misunderstandings of high end equipment. The APD cost double the YGE320. U don't own one so why send out fake news???

The drive reports with no specific version or FW version etc? Its a tremendous amount left out from the bare bones report/competitor hate speech. You hadn't asked for a single screen shot of the inverters configurator settings. The boys don't even attempt to exhibit the gravatas to deliver a true technical report or a scientific problem solving methodology.

[Clugh]

I don't get it. 68 volts x 400 amperes is 27.2kW a YGE320 is only rated to 460 amperes peak. The castle XLX2 can definitely do that. Even my castle Hydra Ice 200hv V2s have logged just below 400 amperes.

The APD HV Pro comes in 4 variants: 14S 240A, 16S 400A, 20S 300A, 24S 200A These are Continuous power ratings. 3 Min at 10m/s airflow.

The 16 s version is 400 ampere continuous 600 burst but I think you fail to realize also what a true agnostic inverter should do . If the batteries or air supply is not there it should limit itself to an acceptable limit based on what the supply can truly feed source.

The 20S version would burn 320 amperes at 27.2kW
The 24S version would burn 272 amperes at 27.2kW

Then is the inverter feed forward activated? is it in Traction modes which is an active torque control, which applies a motor phase current limit that ramps proportionally with higher motor duty cycles.

It is not worth the time to argue across cyberspace as the specification of each model are clearly not the same and clearly posted. It is up to you to make the appropriate purchases for your application. If you tell Tony what you want to do they will send the inverter to you already set up but again you have to be able to supply the required parameters and many people do not do that.

[Clugh]

But then again its the same old thing its about the experts abilities in application Borat.. What solution do you have? 1 inverter to a conventional topology of a 12N10P parallel Wye on the same iron expects what new? 2 properly cooled castle 200 in a dual inverter setup will sink > 760,amperes I'll personally stamp it!. The stacked 240 castle hydra is in the Guinness book. If the antiquated YGE320 and the scorpion knocker is the ticket. It will be there soon....

There are a million solutions for the advanced modeler. Chose one. Two F200's weigh around 70 grams together and are 18kW each without heat sink. Much lighter than any singular setup that by conventional design and wind topology would not additionally attenuate the 2 pole and boost the 5th the way a dual inverter setup would.

[Clugh]

The F200 series are set at their maximums for default so the 200 is 300 amperes.

The improved F_Series 200F3[X] ESCs. Building upon our trusted ARM 32-bit architecture, the V2 release features introduce a number of highly requested features into the product range, including configuration options and additional drive modes. The 200F3[X]v2 ESCs are drop-in replaceable to 200F3[X] units. As before, existing features include PWM-frequency dithering and Active Phase-Current Demagnetisation, allowing for smooth control with virtually all powertrain combinations with peak power outputs of up to 18 kW.

NDAA/DFARS-compliant options available upon request. New Feature Set (V2)

• Configuration of drive parameters, signal types and fault handling
• On board bootloader
• Additional Telemetry types: PWM Telemetry and RPM Output
• High-speed telemetry rates when operating DShot
• Reversible operation support (full forwards to full reverse)
• Dynamic signal quality checks across supported input protocols

Feature Set

• Designed and manufactured in Australia using only the highest quality components, ensuring no sacrifice in reliability
• Proprietary firmware designed in Australia
• Plug and play firmware
• Up to 14S (60 V) capable
• Up to 200 A continuous* output current
• 300 A Burst current
• True 10-bit resolution
• Virtually no setup time, with simple motor reverse solder tab
• Auto-detect PWM or DShot
• DShot150 to DShot600 capable (0.15-0.6Mbs/s)
• Up to 750,000 eRPM (protocol dependant)
• Motor agnostic
• Auto PWM output frequency
• Auto timing advance
• Telemetry output
• Automatic current limiting and over-temperature protection
• LED indication
• Digital commands over ProShot (including anti-turtle mode)
• Digital commands over DShot
• Bare-PCB design to allow maximum integration within the end setup
• 8-Layer PCB to ensure minimal track resistance

* Continuous current ratings are at a 100% throttle duty cycle. Continuous rating is defined as max sustained current at 100% throttle for 60 seconds with 33 m/s of airflow.

[Clugh]

If a power output concerned hobbyist actually measured the resistance of the YGE vs the APD they would know those reports assume alot Borat.

[Clugh]

What I didn't hear about in the APD report is the desynchronization typical with your young generation reports well before 400 amperes so is the power supply adequate....🙈🙉🙊

[Clugh]

• 17. Oktober 2010

• #719

Hallo,
hier mal ein erster Zwischenstand meines 4235.
Erster Teilmotor ist fertig
HK 4235 4+5 x1,25 YY bifilar



War eine ganz schöne Quälerei

Gruß Werner

"Looks great.

However, even if the theory says otherwise:
In my experiments in this regard, the bifilar winding has always performed worse than the equivalent mono winding.
thermal at the latest."

VG
Ralph

Borat! do you see what you posted about bifilar winds in 2010?

Did the "experiments and test results" change since then? Because all Die "Skorpionklopfer" trend to bifilar winds in 2024...

U just wound the bifilar in the attachment below for Kai the other day...


🙈🙉🙊

[Clugh]

And thanks for the logs showing the APD "falsely advertises" 400 amperes.....
SMH...

[Clugh]

Here is your 2x1.8mm Bifilar from may 2023 Borat .The 12,500 rpm bearings regardless if they work are a drag if they are not rated for the application. They rob idle current efficiency in that case.


powerscorpion 42XX | Seite 37 | RC-Network.de

sieht top aus.
allerdings, auch wenn die theorie anderes sagt:
bei meinen diesebezüglichen versuchen hat die bifilarwicklung immer schlechter abgeschnitten, als die gleichwertige monowicklung.
spätestens thermisch.


vg
ralph

Oops

[Clugh]

I see Werner used 1.8mm in a single strand which ends up 2 per motor terminal. With the established iron and large parallel strands I don't think it gets any better than this conventionally. Nice wind...Send Werner regards from the USA.

[Clugh]

If you dont know what happens with the multi stranding large wire versus a mono wire. Here is a Diagram of what happens from Dr Dorell in Cambridge UK. Additional Proximity makes the lower DC a wash.

[Clugh]

U dont have to speculate about the DC versus AC any longer. It is as much as 10 times higher than the DC in the parallel strands.

[Clugh]

"The decision has been made" So will it be another bifilar wind Borat?

BTW Borat I know you are here....

Last Activity: Today, 05:12 PM
Joined: Sep 13, 2023
Location: Germany

[Clugh]

Boho1
Today, 04:40 AM
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Ich hoffe, das stellt fest, dass Sie kein Interesse daran haben, mit mir im offenen Forum zu chatten oder zu sprechen, und dass Sie auf Ihrer Spur bleiben, was in den deutschen sozialen Medien ein Trugschluss ist. Wenn Sie hierher kommen, bringen Sie einige echte Daten und die Wahrheit mit. Sie wissen nichts über das Design von Wechselrichtern, also bleiben Sie bitte dabei, das Kupfer um das Eisen zu wickeln. Sie reden dort Unsinn und haben keine Ahnung, wie hoch Ihre Direkt- und Quadraturinduktivitäten sind, um einen Wechselrichter von Anfang an richtig abzustimmen. Sie sprechen über Gleichstrom und betreiben den Wechselrichter mit dem höchsten Widerstand in der Klasse. Ihr Freund, der sein Geld für den Boden herumwirft, weiß nicht einmal, wie er das entsprechende Produkt auswählen soll, hat aber die Dreistigkeit, einen Bericht über APD zu erstatten, während Putins Marionette nichts davon in der Luft halten kann. Du tust den Foren wirklich keinen Gefallen. Genauso wie Sie wissen, dass das Bifilar alles andere als optimal ist, aber verkaufen Sie es trotzdem.

Das echte 1BOHO

Good luck Ralph you need it.... like they need to know powercroco (Borat) is here trying to learn anything he can from the strange American...🙈🙉🙊 If you decide to talk you can start at your contradictory post about bifilar windings or how to log 402 amperes on an inverter with a factory current limit of 250 is what you posted.👀