Freewing 90mm F-22 Raptor - Official Thread

[ElCid]

What are you looking at? I see a V2 fan but not in a F-22 FREEWING 90MM V2 12 BLADE SPECIAL METAL EDF FOR 6S HIGH SPEED - 1750KV

And the F-22 says nothing about a reverse thrust ESC???

This one for 6S

https://www.rc-castle.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=256_308&product_id=9924&sort=p.price&order=DESC

This one for 8S - No reverse on this one.

https://www.rc-castle.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=256_308&product_id=9926&sort=p.price&order=DESC

[Evan D]

I saw just the motor not the combo. It’ll be interesting how these new fans perform. I don’t see how that at 1750kv will have so much thrust.

[ElCid]

I saw just the motor not the combo. It’ll be interesting how these new fans perform. I don’t see how that at 1750kv will have so much thrust.

I will report back once it gets here and after the first flight.i was looking at the combos and the esc that I already have will work fine withe this fan motor combo.

[ElCid]

Evan D - Your thrust vectoring mod looks great but I was wondering if you had see this? I have a ton of HT- LW-PLA and might give these a try but modify them to work off of the elevator servos.

video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94m47ATyaYM

stl files

https://cults3d.com/en/3d-model/game/3d-printing-thrust-vectoring-nozzle-for-f-22-from-motionrc

[Evan D]

I have seen it. I did my mod when I originally built it over four years ago. That came out well afterwards. Though I did think of getting the files, they were pay per view, not sure if they still are, I just left mine as it is. I know of almost no one that has duplicated what I have and only a couple/ few that have done the 3D printed with extra servo way.

My way was no cost, no extra servos, simple. And works very well. I think the 3D way is probably a little more efficient.

[ElCid]

I have seen it. I did my mod when I originally built it over four years ago. That came out well afterwards. Though I did think of getting the files, they were pay per view, not sure if they still are, I just left mine as it is. I know of almost no one that has duplicated what I have and only a couple/ few that have done the 3D printed with extra servo way.

My way was no cost, no extra servos, simple. And works very well. I think the 3D way is probably a little more efficient.

I am thinking a hybrid approach, use your method but with the 3d printed files.

[ElCid]

I will report back once it gets here and after the first flight.i was looking at the combos and the esc that I already have will work fine withe this fan motor combo.

Dropped the new 12 blade v2 fan into my Raptor with the stock ESC and it feels far more responsive, and the vertical is effortless. Feel is very subjective, but it does feel better now. Sounds fantastic...

I managed 3:30 mins of useful throttle on a total flight time of 4:25 not including taxing on a 5000 Mah Admrial battery, cells were +/- 3.70 volts each. No CG changes were required but i did remove the AB because the new motor is 93mm diameter. Not even sure i want to use the new FMS ESC with reverse because it flew so damn well.

[RCGeekMark]

Steering: I fly Jeti DS16v2 with a Jeti Duplex EX R10 REX Assist 2.4GHz Receiver, can I by pass the MCB-E “Nose Steering” and plug nose steering Servo directly into a channel on my receiver without any worry of data confusion on other components on MCB-E??

MCB-E:

Not sure if I can or need to completely bypass the controversial Bluebox (MCB-E)

Unfortunately, transportation & storage limitations will force me to remove both wings after a day of flight.

Frankly, after much research, I’m very concerned, about the MCB-E. Any MCB-E recommendations for my configuration much appreciated. 🙏

[xviper]

Steering: I fly Jeti DS16v2 with a Jeti Duplex EX R10 REX Assist 2.4GHz Receiver, can I by pass the MCB-E “Nose Steering” and plug nose steering Servo directly into a channel on my receiver without any worry of data confusion on other components on MCB-E??

MCB-E:

Not sure if I can or need to completely bypass the controversial Bluebox (MCB-E)

Unfortunately, transportation & storage limitations will force me to remove both wings after a day of flight.

Frankly, after much research, I’m very concerned, about the MCB-E. Any MCB-E recommendations for my configuration much appreciated. 🙏

I can't speak directly about Jeti, as I use only Spektrum. However, it's very common for the nose steering to be isolated from the "blue box", so it can be controlled via the rotary knob or when a steering gyro is added. I think it's only when you isolate the retracts that a problem can arise as the blue box re-directs power from the retract circuit for things like lights. If you remove the blue box entirely, that is no longer an issue but you'll need a light controller.
I've encountered issues with the earlier blue boxes, as in the T-33 and one other Freewing plane. I've kept it on my F-22, except for the steering servo (connected to a steering gyro) and so far, there have not been any issues. To have more "peace of mind" some owners have bypassed the critical control surfaces from the blue box, such as AIL, ELE. These "blue boxes" should not be confused with the newer models that have "control boxes" that do a lot of mixing within. Bypassing control boxes can lead to a more complicated radio set up.

[RCGeekMark]

Thank you xviper for your detailed response. That helps a lot.

[xviper]

Thank you xviper for your detailed response. That helps a lot.
Just for clarification, when you refer to "control boxes", do mean like, Aura 8, Reflex?
Freewing hasn’t started putting any type of "control boxes" in their planes yet have they?

No, by "control box", I mean the Freewing units like what they put into planes like the B2 and the upcoming Eurofighter. In the B2, the control box does mixing for drag brakes, elevons, etc. In the Eurofighter, it mixes for canards, elevons. On other planes, the blue box can also do gear door sequencing. I look at "control boxes" like the next evolution of "blue boxes". So far, neither blue boxes nor control boxes have gyro capability. Here is the "control box" for the B-2:

https://www.motionrc.com/products/freewing-twin-70mm-b-2-spirit-bomber-control-box-fj31711104

It does a bit more than your "MCB" (or blue box), which I view as that integrates what we would normally use "Y's" for. It collects leads from various mirror servos and pushes out a single lead to the RX - eg, ailerons, flaps, dual elevators, dual rudders, retracts.

Things like Aura8 are part gyro, part flight controller. The FMS Reflex is like part gyro, part "collector" (Y's").

[Evan D]

The first one for FW was on the F-14.

I am using the Reflex in a 64mm Rafale. It converts standard AER to elevons, sets throws plus has a gyro and self leveling mode. I like it on one hand but on the other you can't change the programming in it other than selecting another airplane from the on line dashboard software.

[HangarQueen]

Steering: I fly Jeti DS16v2 with a Jeti Duplex EX R10 REX Assist 2.4GHz Receiver, can I by pass the MCB-E “Nose Steering” and plug nose steering Servo directly into a channel on my receiver without any worry of data confusion on other components on MCB-E??

MCB-E:

Not sure if I can or need to completely bypass the controversial Bluebox (MCB-E)

Unfortunately, transportation & storage limitations will force me to remove both wings after a day of flight.

Frankly, after much research, I’m very concerned, about the MCB-E. Any MCB-E recommendations for my configuration much appreciated. 🙏

If you have a receiver with enough channels, you can bypass the MCB-E.
I use a 10-channel receiver on mine, so I can mix tailerons and such, and use a separate channel for nose wheel steering.
I left the MCB-E in only for the lights.

[xviper]

I left the MCB-E in only for the lights.

Don't you need something else plugged into the box to provide power for the lights? Eg. retracts?

[HangarQueen]

Don't you need something else plugged into the box to provide power for the lights? Eg. retracts?

Good question, I'm not really sure which one, but I did connect a channel to the box to supply it with power.

To follow up my previous reply (was in a hurry then), I used an external sequencer (Assan) for the front gear doors, but this has the disadvantage that you have to "arm" it before each flight, or it won't operate. I might replace this with a sequencer programmed into my radio, but this would then require yet another channel (the advantage of the external sequencer is that it requires only one channel, landing gear, as input). I can add this extra channel through an s-bus converter, so I'm a bit lazy to do that.
Basically, the mcb-e was designed to allow people with a 6-channel radio to operate this model, but the known disadvantages are

• multiple reports/claims of problems with this box. Reports of bad soldering, bad contacts. On the other hand, lots of people using this box without any problem.
• an irritating delay in raising the gear after selecting gear up (why I used a separate sequencer instead)
• some people object to the relatively heavy flatcable that is being used to connect wing servos to the box.

[Evan D]

If you have the MCBe for lights it's a no brainer to use it for the gear too and bypass everything else if you like. Does the time to retract bother you that much?

[HangarQueen]

If you have the MCBe for lights it's a no brainer to use it for the gear too and bypass everything else if you like. Does the time to retract bother you that much?

It's not so much about bothering me, it's just that it is useless. I'm used to retract gear immediately after rotation and positive climb, and as such it would be irritating to have to wait for no reason at all for it to actually retract. I have enough channels, so I don't have any need for the mcb-e except for the lights (and even for that I could just add some series resistors if I really wanted to get rid of the box completely, but I don't).
I wanted to use tailerons, I wanted to use separate nose wheel steering (with a lot more expo), et cetera; all of those things make the box redundant, or even a problem to implement this.
I'm not against this box, I just don't need it for the purpose it was designed for, namely reduce the number of required receiver channels. I just tried to list the possible disadvantages, all of which have been reported here, that's all.

[kallend]

You can make a light controller and/or custom gear/door sequencer using something like an ATTiny85 chip. Costs around $4, weighs around 3 grams, behaves exactly the way you program it to behave. Arduino compatible so easy to program.

https://www.amazon.com/DBParts-ATTINY85-20PU-DIP-8-ATTINY85-Microcontroller/dp/B07Z39J6CH/ref=sr_1_2_sspa

[HangarQueen]

You can make a light controller and/or custom gear/door sequencer using something like an ATTiny85 chip. Costs around $4, weighs around 3 grams, behaves exactly the way you program it to behave. Arduino compatible so easy to program.
https://www.amazon.com/DBParts-ATTIN...ef=sr_1_2_sspa

Absolutely.
I did make my own lights controller, for a model that I still haven't finished after 10 years, a B737-300. It is configurable to use inputs to control strobes, anti-collision, navigation and landing lights, depending on the configuration of the aircraft. I really had great fun with that, but never actually used it in a model.
For the gear sequencer, however, it will be easier to just program the radio to do this.
When I bought the F22 model, I was very eager to maiden it, and so I used this Assan sequencer that was sitting in a drawer. It works well, once configured, but having to initialize it before each flight (3 consecutive toggles of the gear channel) is a bit of a pain. In summer, I left the gear down when powering the model down, put new batteries in and began a second flight. As I forgot to initialize the sequencer, nose gear didn't retract. Not a big problem really, rather a nuisance. From then on I took the habit of retracting the gear before powering down, just as a simple reminder for the next flight.

[TangoVector]

Any recommendations for a SBEC/UBEC that handles 8S input?

I started to count the number of servos on my F22 and after ending up at 14 including gear and TV, I have decided to go with a separate SBEC on my 8S version since the ESC I use only puts out 5.5V/8A. I want it to be at least 6V and 14A peak. I plan to use the ESC to power gear and lights. CastleCreations BEC 2.0 seems lika good idea.