All-New Freewing PJ50 Twin 70mm EDF Jet - Official Thread

[Twowingtj]

New flight video from a reviewer down under. He's done an unboxing vid as well. Looks promising so far. He's using a 72oomah lipo. Didn't look like it flew heavy at all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUGiq5tgzQc

xviper Looking forward to your impressions, when you get it.

[xviper]

New flight video from a reviewer down under. He's done an unboxing vid as well. Looks promising so far. He's using a 72oomah lipo. Didn't look like it flew heavy at all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUGiq5tgzQc

xviper Looking forward to your impressions, when you get it.

That was a terrific "post-promo" flight, as good as I've seen, maybe even better than what's been seen in videos of either Bizjet so far.
It should be landing in Vancouver any day now and a few more days to get to me. It can sit there for days before the customs guys take a look at it. I won't do any unboxing vids as they've been done already. I'll pop a couple pics along the way and do a quick vid from inside my garage showing the thrust reverse (assuming I can figure out how to do it). The two Avian ESCs and 637T are on the table waiting.

[Twowingtj]

My Only issue with this bird, so far, is that they pre-applied a Freewing logo on the tail.

I'll be doing some sort of custom scheme work to it. Just haven't decided what yet.

I know with the Avian reversing ESCs, you have to have the electronic motor braking on, if you are going to use reversing. Not sure how much drag that might create in flight, during "coast" throttle setting.

[GliderGuy]

New flight video from a reviewer down under. He's done an unboxing vid as well. Looks promising so far. He's using a 72oomah lipo. Didn't look like it flew heavy at all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUGiq5tgzQc

xviper Looking forward to your impressions, when you get it.

Thanks for the video link, TW. I can hardly wait!

I'm gonna maiden mine without a gyro (as is my AL37), and I am also going to evaluate whether or not adding internal carbon bracing to the top skin near the fuselage (max bending moment area) might be needed to better withstand the acrobatics I will be doing with it...and also the likely high number of flights it will be making.

Without the added stress of the engine nacelles, my gut feeling is that the internal top-skin bracing won't be needed. But, if I can add it easily, I will probably add it just to make sure I don't get the top-skin cracking I saw in my first AL37 which I retired after many, many flights due to the ugly cracks that developed and then kept getting worse even after an attempted repair. See photo below:

Added note: The AL37 I am currently flying with the added internal top-skin bracing is showing only a few very tiny hairline cracks in the paint, but they are not growing in size. A quick sanding and brushing on a new paint coat over the area will make them easily disappear. I've proven to myself that the internal carbon bracing to the top skin is a valid mod for the AL37 to better withstand acro + lots of flights. It might be a valid mod for the PJ50....this remains to be seen.

-GG

(First repair attempt didn't work and the paint didn't match. Photo below was taken at #1 bird's retirement.)

[xviper]

My Only issue with this bird, so far, is that they pre-applied a Freewing logo on the tail.

I'll be doing some sort of custom scheme work to it. Just haven't decided what yet.

I know with the Avian reversing ESCs, you have to have the electronic motor braking on, if you are going to use reversing. Not sure how much drag that might create in flight, during "coast" throttle setting.

Yes, it was the same with my AL-37 tail. Luckily, the WestJet theme had a similar blue on the tail section, just not the patterned effect of the stock decal. I just painted the part that needed paint and left the tail as it was. The vertical tail, I had the Callie decal to cover it all. If I were quicker thinking and a bit smarter, I would have used the spare vertical tail that RC Castle sent as a gift along with the whole plane. It was a blank canvass.
I've got the Avian reverse on 2 of my other jets and there doesn't seem to be much drag when "coasting" as I rarely have zero throttle while in flight and when I do during those brief moments, any additional drag is hard to detect. With near "idle" throttle, the fan still turns. My only unknown is that I'll be programming 2 ESCs "Y'd" together. I think it won't be a problem but won't know till I try it. I've read someone else has already done it with twin Avians. If it works out well, I may do the same on my AL-37.

[f4u ausie]

I too have been suprised at the possible livery 4 this jet .. some of the multie color corprate graphics r amazing,, being an auto painter,, i can appreciate the time, money involved,,, 4 those that hav way to much money... michey also seemed to hav a little up elev.... but not as much as james.. is that nose heavy or something else...??

[Gilatrout]

Yes, it was the same with my AL-37 tail. Luckily, the WestJet theme had a similar blue on the tail section, just not the patterned effect of the stock decal. I just painted the part that needed paint and left the tail as it was. The vertical tail, I had the Callie decal to cover it all. If I were quicker thinking and a bit smarter, I would have used the spare vertical tail that RC Castle sent as a gift along with the whole plane. It was a blank canvass.
I've got the Avian reverse on 2 of my other jets and there doesn't seem to be much drag when "coasting" as I rarely have zero throttle while in flight and when I do during those brief moments, any additional drag is hard to detect. With near "idle" throttle, the fan still turns. My only unknown is that I'll be programming 2 ESCs "Y'd" together. I think it won't be a problem but won't know till I try it. I've read someone else has already done it with twin Avians. If it works out well, I may do the same on my AL-37.

FWIW, Horizon's statement for twin reversing "isn't possible". This is 100% horse crap as Ali demonstrated as much on the H9 Bronco.

I set it up my twin Otter. Details are in that thread. Basically it just works if you set it up so the throttle is on a Y and are using a Smart receiver. Separate channels and you will run into issues with configuring throttle cut and failsafe settings. Not insurmountable, but not trivial. Therefore my advice is stick to the Y configuration. Be sure to also disable (remove) the power wire from one of the ESCs. It works, but there maybe some issues with telemetry etc from the ESC. I haven't done extensive testing to see.

[xviper]

FWIW, Horizon's statement for twin reversing "isn't possible". This is 100% horse crap as Ali demonstrated as much on the H9 Bronco.

I set it up my twin Otter. Details are in that thread. Basically it just works if you set it up so the throttle is on a Y and are using a Smart receiver. Separate channels and you will run into issues with configuring throttle cut and failsafe settings. Not insurmountable, but not trivial. Therefore my advice is stick to the Y configuration. Be sure to also disable (remove) the power wire from one of the ESCs. It works, but there maybe some issues with telemetry etc from the ESC. I haven't done extensive testing to see.

Would it damage anything if both power wires were left intact? Or does this cause problems with programming both ESCs for reverse?

[Gilatrout]

Would it damage anything if both power wires were left intact? Or does this cause problems with programming both ESCs for reverse?

yes, it is possible to damage the electronics by having two becs sending power to the receiver. To be clear I'm talking about the center wire in the throttle cable connected to the receiver.

Programming the escs don't have anything to do with the Bec, so it is not a problem to disconnect it. You will need to program each esc independently and not when both are connected. Program one first, then disconnect it, then program the other, then you can connect both to the receiver. I used the programming box, but you can also use your transmitter.

One thing to keep in mind is the motor rotation setting. I don't know if the PJ has counter rotating fans or not. If so, then be sure to keep track of this setting and which motor it is connected to when putting everything back together.


Edit...
I realized that I didn't really answer the question.

If you are using the programming box, you can disable the Bec before programming because the throttle cable isn't connected to anything.

However if you use the transmitter, since each ESC must be programmed separately and must be connected to the receiver to work, then yes the Bec must be connected to power the rx. Just be sure to disable one of the Becs after programming and when hooking it all back together.

Also, I guess I can't really.say for sure if you can or cannot program both escs at the same time. My instinct is that this could be problematic. I'm my case because.i wanted a counter rotating setup, it was impossible. To be safe, program each esc one at a time.

[Evan D]

PB&J does have a counter rotating on one side. I usually try programing/ calibrating twins together and it usually works. On the rare time It doesn't I'll unplug one ESC at the Y, do it then plug in the other and do it... no issue.

[xviper]

My concern was about damaging something when both throttle power wires were left intact. Even though one engine is opposite rotation to the other, this is done at the 3 motors wires, so from the ESCs perspective, both are running "forward" and when switched, both run "reverse".
Insofar as throttle calibration, Dynam have been using parallel powered throttle wires "Y'd" on their twins for a very long time and even ESC programming can (on the most part) be done while parallel powered, unless the 2 ESCs were vastly different in some way due to manufacturing errors. In the case of these Avian smart ESCs and the PJ, it's not just a simple throttle calibration or even ESC programming for "normal" things that most ESCs get altered for. In this case, we're dealing with making changes to the braking, motor rotation and switch assignment, running through a "ghost" channel. This is where I'm a bit in the dark. I guess I'll find out soon enough when I start "playing" with it. I've got the rest of winter to fix/replace stuff if I break them.

[Gilatrout]

I calibrated the throttle on a y connection after initialization with the Bec disabled on one esc.

The escs were programmed either through the transmitter or programming box.

Was that 8 beeps or 9?

[avanti127]

Yes, it was the same with my AL-37 tail. Luckily, the WestJet theme had a similar blue on the tail section, just not the patterned effect of the stock decal. I just painted the part that needed paint and left the tail as it was. The vertical tail, I had the Callie decal to cover it all. If I were quicker thinking and a bit smarter, I would have used the spare vertical tail that RC Castle sent as a gift along with the whole plane. It was a blank canvass.
I've got the Avian reverse on 2 of my other jets and there doesn't seem to be much drag when "coasting" as I rarely have zero throttle while in flight and when I do during those brief moments, any additional drag is hard to detect. With near "idle" throttle, the fan still turns. My only unknown is that I'll be programming 2 ESCs "Y'd" together. I think it won't be a problem but won't know till I try it. I've read someone else has already done it with twin Avians. If it works out well, I may do the same on my AL-37.

I have them on my AL37 for years now and they work great. Oops, sorry I have the Avro not Avians.

[avanti127]

My Callie graphics came today. At least that is here, patiently waiting now for the box to arrive. To cold to paint these days anyway.

[Gilatrout]

My Callie graphics came today. At least that is here, patiently waiting now for the box to arrive. To cold to paint these days anyway.

My graphics arrived yesterday. Callie is amazing.

Going with this livery

I've been resisting heading over to the art supply store for paint. March is so far away...

[xviper]

I have them on my AL37 for years now and they work great. Oops, sorry I have the Avro not Avians.

If only HobbyKing kept any stock on them. Did you just Y everything together? Throttle wires? Reverse wires? Defeat one of the power wires?

[avanti127]

Yes I Y'd everything together. It worked really well without issue.

[avanti127]

My Livery...

I had Callie print me a color swatch of the platinum so I can take that and get it color match. I do that a lot with my planes instead of taking panels to HD.

[xviper]

This just in................

[Gilatrout]

This just in................

Sweet.