Official FMS 1500mm P-47D Razorback Thread

[davegee]

That looks absolutely amazing!! Great work my friend!
The Curtis Electric prop dome is a cool idea but I personally prefer the shorter stubbie dome.

I recently acquired a FMS 1700mm P-47D and swapped it's stock 17x10 prop with the 18x11 from the Razorback. The bigger Thunderbolt desperately needed the bigger prop and I will test fly it shortly.
So I have now (temporarily) fitted the Razorback with the smaller 17x10 prop to see how it flys. Even though it is an inch smaller in diameter it still looks reasonably scale and I don't mind how it looks but the performance improvement is quite noticeable! Clearly the stock motor is able to turn the smaller shallower prop much more easily but I will not keep the smaller prop on this plane as I have already ordered a new replacement 18x11 (Corsair V3) prop for the Razorback so I can keep the bigger prop on the Thunderbolt. I am perfectly happy with how it flys with the bigger prop.

I think the thing that drove me to research doing a Curtiss Electric prop dome was the fact that the majority of P-47s produced had the bullet shaped Curtiss Electric prop dome installed. In fact, that's why I chose the I wanted Wings scheme because the real plane had the Hamilton Standard prop installed. So really not until I heard from you in your blogs that you had success with the larger FMS prop on the 1500mm FMS P-47, did I start getting serious about doing that. Since I don't have a 3D printer, I was stymied until I found someone willing to do it from my plans that I drew up. He is working on a larger CE prop dome for the larger prop now, and I hope to do a test flight in a few weeks when I get it shipped to me. And this new CE dome will adorn my Hairless Joe plane that had one installed. Part of it is also the challenge of doing this, and checking its performance with some minor scratchbuilt scale additions like the cuffs that I will have at the base of the props.

I think I like both props, but prefer them to be the right ones for the airplanes that I am modeling. I guess I am a hopeless scale geek, but there's no changing that now. I've been seriously modeling for over 60 years!

Question: where were you able to find the 1700mm FMS P-47D? Is that a bubble top? I had one years ago but thought they sorta disappeared after they quit production on them years ago. If I was able to score a NIB plane, I would definitely want to do a new project with it and the bigger prop and the Hamilton Standard dome! Please advise how the 1700mm jug does with the bigger Corsair prop!

Cheers

davegee

[spanner76]

The livery looks fantastic and yes it definitely needs the pointy spinner cone as with the real plane. Looking forward to seeing it fitted up!

I too am more on the scale side of things and will fit the replacement 18incher on the Razorback when it arrives even if it reduces some of the performance.. Its a shame there aren't any bigger direct replacement prop blades for the 1700mm FMS planes as 18inches is as large as they ever came unfortunately. From my previous calculations the prop for the FMS 1700mm Corsair and P-47D (bubble canopy) would need to be closer to 22 inches in diameter! But that would require much more motor and power system upgrades to run properly. My 1700mm Corsair has been upgraded to 8S so it could probably run a larger prop over 18" but finding one to fit is another thing.

Yes I was able to find a FMS 1700mm P-47D. And its pretty good condition too! We had to drive 8 hours away to go get it but it was absolutely worth 16hours round trip! Was a fun little adventure. And it was cheap too! only cost me $450 (Aussie dollars).
I will include some photos of it and other photos of me messing about with other props on these planes. I am sure you will find it somewhat interesting 😅

First up is the newly acquired FMS 1700 P-47D with the 18" prop fitted.
The the P-47D with the 17" prop and spinner from the FMS 1700 Red Tails P-51D. Purely for sh!ts n giggles.
And then the 1.5m FMS Razorback with a 17" prop and spinner set which I previously had on the 1700 Corsair before the 8S upgrade.
Although those won't remain on those planes.. I was curious to see what they would look like as Racers!

[davegee]

The livery looks fantastic and yes it definitely needs the pointy spinner cone as with the real plane. Looking forward to seeing it fitted up!

I too am more on the scale side of things and will fit the replacement 18incher on the Razorback when it arrives even if it reduces some of the performance.. Its a shame there aren't any bigger direct replacement prop blades for the 1700mm FMS planes as 18inches is as large as they ever came unfortunately. From my previous calculations the prop for the FMS 1700mm Corsair and P-47D (bubble canopy) would need to be closer to 22 inches in diameter! But that would require much more motor and power system upgrades to run properly. My 1700mm Corsair has been upgraded to 8S so it could probably run a larger prop over 18" but finding one to fit is another thing.

Yes I was able to find a FMS 1700mm P-47D. And its pretty good condition too! We had to drive 8 hours away to go get it but it was absolutely worth 16hours round trip! Was a fun little adventure. And it was cheap too! only cost me $450 (Aussie dollars).
I will include some photos of it and other photos of me messing about with other props on these planes. I am sure you will find it somewhat interesting 😅

First up is the newly acquired FMS 1700 P-47D with the 18" prop fitted.
The the P-47D with the 17" prop and spinner from the FMS 1700 Red Tails P-51D. Purely for sh!ts n giggles.
And then the 1.5m FMS Razorback with a 17" prop and spinner set which I previously had on the 1700 Corsair before the 8S upgrade.
Although those won't remain on those planes.. I was curious to see what they would look like as Racers!

Ah, Yes! I remember the ol' 1700mm FMS P-47 fondly. Flew it a ton, then it basically was worn out and I eventually discarded it many years ago. If I'm ever able to find one NIB or at least in excellent shape like you did, I'll probably buy one, too.

Thanks for the great pics showing how the props look on those airplanes. Enjoyed seeing the pics with the "racing prop spinner." The boys at Farmingdale did all sorts of things to try to get the maximum performance out of their airplanes.

Interesting you mentioned about needing more propeller to make it scale. You may already know this, but one thing the engineers at Republic did to get prop clearance on the ground was a "shrinker bar". This ingenious, mechanical rod in each main gear forced the gear to "shrink" about 9 inches during gear retraction to allow it to fit in the wheel wells. I've even seen a gear with this device on a very high end model gear for a top of the line P-47. kit. I never went to that extreme, but thought it was pretty cool.

Again, congrats of finding that 1700mm gold nugget, and look forward to see what you do making it and flying it. Will post pics and flying results of my CE prop when I get to it in a few weeks.

Cheers

davegee

[spanner76]

Ah yes I remember reading something about that little mechanical trick they used. The huge props they fitted to some WW2 fighters was just insane!

Yeah I am stoked to have been able to find one! I had been looking around for a while but not much came up other than bits n pieces or international.. I just so happened to spot this one in FB marketplace and the seller had only listed it about an hour before and I was the first to ask about it. Initially he was a little hesitant in me buying it from so far away but I assured him I was definitely going to make the trek from Sydney to QLD to get it as he wasn't going to do shipping. This one is nearly 10 years old but has been looked after and is still in flight worthy condition as far as I can tell. The fuselage and wings still do feel structurally sound. The previous owner has replaced some things including all the retracts so hopefully it will all work well.

There was one (Hun Hunter XVI livery) in Western Australia brand new in box never assembled but the seller wanted $1500 and would not ship it.. strictly pickups only. But that would have been just too crazy a trip to go and get it considering it takes 4 to 5 hours as a flight. It would have been days worth of driving to go get it. It was in Geraldton if I am not mistaken which is another 5 hours north of Perth.. Can no longer find the listing so I assume it sold. oh well.

But if another does come up I'll probably grab it too!

[davegee]

Ah yes I remember reading something about that little mechanical trick they used. The huge props they fitted to some WW2 fighters was just insane!

Yeah I am stoked to have been able to find one! I had been looking around for a while but not much came up other than bits n pieces or international.. I just so happened to spot this one in FB marketplace and the seller had only listed it about an hour before and I was the first to ask about it. Initially he was a little hesitant in me buying it from so far away but I assured him I was definitely going to make the trek from Sydney to QLD to get it as he wasn't going to do shipping. This one is nearly 10 years old but has been looked after and is still in flight worthy condition as far as I can tell. The fuselage and wings still do feel structurally sound. The previous owner has replaced some things including all the retracts so hopefully it will all work well.

There was one (Hun Hunter XVI livery) in Western Australia brand new in box never assembled but the seller wanted $1500 and would not ship it.. strictly pickups only. But that would have been just too crazy a trip to go and get it considering it takes 4 to 5 hours as a flight. It would have been days worth of driving to go get it. It was in Geraldton if I am not mistaken which is another 5 hours north of Perth.. Can no longer find the listing so I assume it sold. oh well.

But if another does come up I'll probably grab it too!

I had all three of the 1700mm FMS planes at the same time: the Corsair, the P-51D bubbletop, and the P-47D bubbletop. The Corsair still exists, but I sold it to a friend years ago and he has it hanging up in his workshop. I enjoyed flying all of them. I think the only real knock on them that I remember is that they were sorta slow, even below a scale speed for their size. Still, I really liked them. That makes me wonder if your new larger prop idea might put some more authority into the flight performance of your new plane. I look forward to hearing how it goes! Best of luck, and have a lot of fun with it!

Cheers

davegee

[spanner76]

I currently have all the of the 1700 series, were they any others in the line up other than different paint schemes? I thought I saw a 1700 Razorback but may be wrong. But having a Razorback in that size would be epic too!

The Corsair was very slow even after the 360kv motor upgrade which is why I have since upgraded the power system to 8S. Flys bloody awesome now though! Wow what a difference!

I just fitted the P-47D with the 360kv and the larger prop, will maiden that soon. The 300kv motor it had felt very week when I did a full power run and was barely pulling 70amps.. when I pulled that old motor out I found that it was full of dirt and the cavity where the ESC sits was also full of dirt and mud so I can only assume that it's had some misadventure at some point which the previous owner didn't mention. He only said that he had to belly land it once when a retract wouldn't extend. Even the original 85amp ESC looks to have possible water damage and I quite surprised it was still working at all!
It now feels like it has trucks load of power with the new motor and a 110amp ESC and it draws right up to 110amps at full throttle! Huge improvement! I'd say the 360kv motor and ESC upgrade will be quite sufficient as the P-47 is quite a bit lighter than the Corsair and visually a less draggy aero design.

I am yet to maiden the 1700 P-51D as I just have too many planes going on at the moment but she'll be flying soon too! I am in no rush and happy to admire these beauties just sitting there like in my own personal little warbird museum! I am considering getting another 360kv motor for it as I have heard some say they too are a little slow for their size. But I'll probably wait until I maiden it to decide.

[davegee]

I currently have all the of the 1700 series, were they any others in the line up other than different paint schemes? I thought I saw a 1700 Razorback but may be wrong. But having a Razorback in that size would be epic too!

The Corsair was very slow even after the 360kv motor upgrade which is why I have since upgraded the power system to 8S. Flys bloody awesome now though! Wow what a difference!

I just fitted the P-47D with the 360kv and the larger prop, will maiden that soon. The 300kv motor it had felt very week when I did a full power run and was barely pulling 70amps.. when I pulled that old motor out I found that it was full of dirt and the cavity where the ESC sits was also full of dirt and mud so I can only assume that it's had some misadventure at some point which the previous owner didn't mention. He only said that he had to belly land it once when a retract wouldn't extend. Even the original 85amp ESC looks to have possible water damage and I quite surprised it was still working at all!
It now feels like it has trucks load of power with the new motor and a 110amp ESC and it draws right up to 110amps at full throttle! Huge improvement! I'd say the 360kv motor and ESC upgrade will be quite sufficient as the P-47 is quite a bit lighter than the Corsair and visually a less draggy aero design.

I am yet to maiden the 1700 P-51D as I just have too many planes going on at the moment but she'll be flying soon too! I am in no rush and happy to admire these beauties just sitting there like in my own personal little warbird museum! I am considering getting another 360kv motor for it as I have heard some say they too are a little slow for their size. But I'll probably wait until I maiden it to decide.

I don't think they ever came out with a razorback P-47D in that scale, and the 1500mm FMS model replaced the larger 1700mm plane. Interesting, I knew a pilot who flew with that fighter group as your plane is painted up in. They flew out of Italy. They dropped a lot of bombs, and were short some of the proper bomb shackles on the wing pylons, and only had shackles meant for the P-40. Since that is all they had, they modified them to work on the Jug. Unfortunately, sometimes one of the bombs would "hang up" and not drop as planned. They couldn't shake it loose, and so when they landed, the bombs would jar loose on contact with the runway, and roll down the runway along with the airplane and pilot desperately trying to get away from it! On occasion the bomb would explode, taking out the airplane, and sometimes the pilot with it. As if they didn't have enough to worry about!!

I had an earlier yellow nose1700mm FMS P-51D bubbletop, one in the colors of the 361st FG "Yellow Jackets." It flew well, but again, a bit slow. I had a ton of flights on it until one day, I took off and the motor and prop departed the airplane and landed some distance off in the field. The rest of the plane, now without all that weight in the nose, dived in and crashed. That was the end of that, but I was still happy I got so much fun flying it for a couple of years. As the saying goes, "they all come back in a body bag, at some point!" Turns out the molded plastic lugs broke off in the fuselage and allowed the propeller and motor to launch away from the plane at full power.

Nice collection of planes you have Do you have a paved road or runway to fly off of, or is it sod or grass or dirt? We have a paved runway, but pretty rough in spots.

Cheers

davegee

[spanner76]

Yeah have heard many stories about stuck ordinance issues, not an ideal situation for any pilot to face. Scary stuff!

That's a shame you lost that Mustang in that way.. have seen a few prop departures but never happened to me. I don't usually fly too aggressively or flat out so here's hoping that helps!

The fields I fly from are all grass which has played havoc with some planes with sensitive nose gear like my Freewing T-33..

There are some fields with paved or Astroturf runways but they are all too far away to be practical to go to.

I had many other planes but have been off loading a few and wanting to keep mostly the warbirds.

I see FMS has had another 1700mm plane, the F7F Tigercat which looks amazing but not available anywhere.. Can't see any others in that size.

[davegee]

Yeah have heard many stories about stuck ordinance issues, not an ideal situation for any pilot to face. Scary stuff!

That's a shame you lost that Mustang in that way.. have seen a few prop departures but never happened to me. I don't usually fly too aggressively or flat out so here's hoping that helps!

The fields I fly from are all grass which has played havoc with some planes with sensitive nose gear like my Freewing T-33..

There are some fields with paved or Astroturf runways but they are all too far away to be practical to go to.

I had many other planes but have been off loading a few and wanting to keep mostly the warbirds.

I see FMS has had another 1700mm plane, the F7F Tigercat which looks amazing but not available anywhere.. Can't see any others in that size.

Losing my 1700mm FMS P-51D that way, although spectacular, was a disappointment, for sure. It was totally unpredicted. The airplane had never been crashed or had a hard landing, and I always flew it at scale speeds and using scale maneuvers. And unfortunately, they discontinued that particular livery (361st FG Yellowjackets), one of my favorites on P-51s, but they do still have the Tuskegee red tail version available. That's the way it goes, sometimes.

I really like my T-33, have had it for years, and have had to replace several nose gear struts. Turns out, over time, I lost track of exactly where the battery was supposed to go, and started placing it too far forward in the fuse. I finally decided to re-CG the plane, and discovered my goof. I might have had one nose gear pin break due to a lousy landing since then, but it flies much better and is one of my favorite EDFs to fly.

Our runway here is pretty rough, needs a resurfacing or at least filling in some of the big cracks that sometimes affect flying, but it is very expensive, probably outside of the budget of our little club, for now. I'm willing to pony up some $$$ to help make it happen, and possibly we'll come up with a viable plan someday. I pretty much have to limit or defer flying my B-2 flying wing for now, just because the runway is so punishing on the gear if you roll over one of the many divots or cracks in the runway. Doesn't seem to affect the prop planes, like the P-47, which have a much shorter ground roll than the jets at this altitude (5,000' MSL) and their exposure to the hazards on the runway is less.

[davegee]

For anyone interested in the FMS 1500mm P-47D razorback, I just got an email promotion from FMS today outlining a relaxing somewhat of the strict shipping rules regarding many of their products, including the P-47 model. It is now available for shipping from distribution points within the USA with free shipping and $429.00 cost. I just ordered one as a spare/future project since they were so hard to come by for a few years now. Just and FYI, for those interested.

Cheers

Davegee

[davegee]

For anyone interested in the FMS 1500mm P-47D razorback, I just got an email promotion from FMS today outlining a relaxing somewhat of the strict shipping rules regarding many of their products, including the P-47 model. It is now available for shipping from distribution points within the USA with free shipping and $429.00 cost. I just ordered one as a spare/future project since they were so hard to come by for a few years now. Just and FYI, for those interested.

Cheers

Davegee

My 1500mm P-47D razorback shipped to me in about 4 days or so from Florida to rural northwest WY via Fedex ground. I was very impressed, being that there were a few storms between there and my home.

The quality of the kit that I got was in perfect shape. By putting the larger V3 1700mm Corsair prop on it, it will look and fly as it should as a replica of the real thing in foam.

Again, this will be a total repaint and include some more detailing as I have done with my other two models. I'm leaning towards a scheme named "Ol' Cock" that was flown by a man named Donavan Smith. He became commander of the 61st Fighter Squadron of the 56th Fighter Group in England during WWII, an ace, and later rose to the rank of lieutenant general (3 stars) before passing away from brain cancer at the age of 51. Below is a drawing from a book of the one I am thinking of doing, haven't made the final decision yet.

[spanner76]

My 1500mm P-47D razorback shipped to me in about 4 days or so from Florida to rural northwest WY via Fedex ground. I was very impressed, being that there were a few storms between there and my home.

The quality of the kit that I got was in perfect shape. By putting the larger V3 1700mm Corsair prop on it, it will look and fly as it should as a replica of the real thing in foam.

Again, this will be a total repaint and include some more detailing as I have done with my other two models. I'm leaning towards a scheme named "Ol' Cock" that was flown by a man named Donavan Smith. He became commander of the 61st Fighter Squadron of the 56th Fighter Group in England during WWII, an ace, and later rose to the rank of lieutenant general (3 stars) before passing away from brain cancer at the age of 51. Below is a drawing from a book of the one I am thinking of doing, haven't made the final decision yet.

I have the 18" v3 Corsair prop on my P-47 and it fly's great! Although I fitted a slightly larger but lower KV motor and a higher rated ESC in mine.

[davegee]

I have the 18" v3 Corsair prop on my P-47 and it fly's great! Although I fitted a slightly larger but lower KV motor and a higher rated ESC in mine.

What ESC did you put in your plane?

[spanner76]

What ESC did you put in your plane?

its a JP EnErG Pro 110amp.

[davegee]

its a JP EnErG Pro 110amp.

Thanks, I'll keep it in mind. I had about 6-7 flights using the big props on my two P-47s last year. Probably won't be able to fly until next spring, but the flights I had were quite encouraging, even on the smaller 80A ESC. Cooling issues were never a problem, fortunately.

davegee

[spanner76]

Thanks, I'll keep it in mind. I had about 6-7 flights using the big props on my two P-47s last year. Probably won't be able to fly until next spring, but the flights I had were quite encouraging, even on the smaller 80A ESC. Cooling issues were never a problem, fortunately.

davegee

Same for me, I ran the stock ESC for several flights and it was fine.
I have since replaced the stock ESC and motor with motor and ESC from my downed Draco. So now my Razorback runs a 5065 with a lower kV rating and the 100amp Spektrum Avian smart ESC, setup with throttle reversing for shorter landings.

I have now moved the JP EnErG 110a ESC into my 1700mm P-47D which also now runs an 18inch prop.

[davegee]

Same for me, I ran the stock ESC for several flights and it was fine.
I have since replaced the stock ESC and motor with motor and ESC from my downed Draco. So now my Razorback runs a 5065 with a lower kV rating and the 100amp Spektrum Avian smart ESC, setup with throttle reversing for shorter landings.

I have now moved the JP EnErG 110a ESC into my 1700mm P-47D which also now runs an 18inch prop.

sounds like a good plan!!👍👍👍

[davegee]

My 1500mm P-47D razorback shipped to me in about 4 days or so from Florida to rural northwest WY via Fedex ground. I was very impressed, being that there were a few storms between there and my home.

The quality of the kit that I got was in perfect shape. By putting the larger V3 1700mm Corsair prop on it, it will look and fly as it should as a replica of the real thing in foam.

Again, this will be a total repaint and include some more detailing as I have done with my other two models. I'm leaning towards a scheme named "Ol' Cock" that was flown by a man named Donavan Smith. He became commander of the 61st Fighter Squadron of the 56th Fighter Group in England during WWII, an ace, and later rose to the rank of lieutenant general (3 stars) before passing away from brain cancer at the age of 51. Below is a drawing from a book of the one I am thinking of doing, haven't made the final decision yet.

I had a little free time today to do some detailing on the false R2800 engine that goes in front of the electric motor for flight. One pic shows the scratchbuilit wiring harnesses that go around the engine crankcase, and the other photo shows them installed. Did the same with my previous P-47D Hairless Joe (see above). This system has been flown repeatedly even in fairly warm weather, and has not had any issues heating up the motor, ESC, or battery. I'll order the vinyl transfers I need to make the "Ole Cock" replica flown by Donavan Smith in WWII.

[spanner76]

I had a little free time today to do some detailing on the false R2800 engine that goes in front of the electric motor for flight. One pic shows the scratchbuilit wiring harnesses that go around the engine crankcase, and the other photo shows them installed. Did the same with my previous P-47D Hairless Joe (see above). This system has been flown repeatedly even in fairly warm weather, and has not had any issues heating up the motor, ESC, or battery. I'll order the vinyl transfers I need to make the "Ole Cock" replica flown by Donavan Smith in WWII.

that looks fantastic!

[davegee]

that looks fantastic!

Thanks, spanner 76. It's fairly easy to do, especially if you've done a number of other R2800 mock-engines before. I've done some pretty detailed 1/5 or 1/6 scale false motors that were forward of a big gas engine that a buddy of mine and I flew in competitions for a few years. I'll attach one photo of the false R2800 motor that was installed in a 1/5 scale F4U-1A Corsair that has been hanging in the Naval Aviation Museum in Pensacola, FL since 2013.

For these foamie projects, I just wanted to add a little detail in places where it was reasonable to do so. I photographed the plastic cylinders on the model and then photocopied them, cut them out, and glued them in some of the holes to give an appearance of a rear bank of cylinders like what the R2800 had. I still get adequate cooling through the plane with ram air that hasn't been a problem for the electric motor, ESCs, or batteries.