Alternative motor windings and drive schemes

[Clugh]

I just want the forum to see Dr Ralph Okon (powercroco) hasn't a CLUGH about the winding program here. He is just hating because I'm doing better than him. Now I'll continue to show the interested the new winds and ideas win lose or draw NO on has to implement a thing from the IEEE. It will survive...better than the burned up yge's

Thank you
Hubert

[Clugh]

Its below Helmuts speed line theory and you doubly wrong about my data. So you've been making a fool out of yourself for sometime now. 🤣 Industry also uses the mathematics........

Holle's calculator is good to go . The load point is 158 amperes right at the knee. That's not going to overload 2x 13 AWG @ UVW DC man. 824 Kv. It's phase resistance is 5 milliohms !!! A parallel delta in this size would be death to the AC and also have a resistance LOWER than a YGE. That is not a good thing if you know anything about impedance matching "Dr Okon"...... That's an excellent way to overload and drive the inverter into clipping. This six step wye on the other hand runs as quiet as the fan on the castle inverter whose on resistance is at least 2 times lower than this motor. But you experts on the German social media don't talk about things like that. Well Holle would i guess and maybe Alois and Micha.

Es liegt unter Helmuts Theorie der Drehzahlkurve, und du liegst mit meinen Daten doppelt falsch. Du machst dich also schon seit einiger Zeit lächerlich. 🤣 Auch die Industrie nutzt Mathematik........
Holles Rechner ist nützlich. Der Lastpunkt liegt bei 158 Ampere, genau am Knie. Das überlastet 2 x 13 AWG @ UVW DC nicht. 824 kV. Der Phasenwiderstand beträgt 5 Milliohm!!! Eine Parallel-Dreieck-Schaltung dieser Größe wäre für den Wechselstrom fatal und hätte zudem einen NIEDRIGEREN Widerstand als eine YGE. Das ist nicht gut, wenn Sie etwas von Impedanzanpassung verstehen, „Dr. Okon“...... Es ist eine hervorragende Möglichkeit, den Wechselrichter zu überlasten und ihn bis zum Clipping zu treiben. Diese sechsstufige Stern-Stern-Schaltung hingegen läuft so leise wie der Lüfter des Burg-Wechselrichters, dessen Durchlasswiderstand mindestens halb so hoch ist wie der dieses Motors. Aber ihr Experten in den deutschen sozialen Medien redet nicht über solche Dinge. Also, Holle würde es wahrscheinlich tun, und vielleicht auch Alois und Micha.

[Clugh]

02-21-2023, 04:49 AM

"Hi 1BOHO,

I'll put the drawing here that shows where to place the Hall probes on the 10 pole.

and another picture of what you do with the engine electronics today. This is why an extremely low-impedance motor with a high maximum speed is used and the peak power is already reached at 20% of the maximum speed.
I'll see if I can post anything about it."

Happy Amps Christian

[Clugh]

"I don't understand this!
how can losses, which become higher with higher load be included in I o?"
~ Ralph Okon~ May 14, 2022, 12:28 PM






~Eaton~
References 1. Bean, R.L., Crackan, N., Moore, H.R., and Wentz, E. (1959). Transformers for the electric power industry. New York: McGraw-Hill. 2. IEEE Std 389 (1996) IEEE Recommended Practice for Testing Electronics Transformers and Inductors, American National Standard (ANSI). 3. CFR Title 10 Chapter II Part 431, Appendix A of Subpart K Distribution Transformers (2016). http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-dx?SID= 9e1d79536391f4253d35753871479988&mc= true&node=pt10.3.431&rgn=div5#sp10.3.431.k 4. L.F. Blume, A. Boyajian, G. Camilli, T.C. Lennox, S. Minneci, V.M. Montsinger (1951). Transformer Engineering. New York: John Wiley & Sons. 5. K. Al-khalifah and E. F. El-saadany, “Investigation of Magnetizing Inrush Current in a Single-Phase Transformer,” Power Engineering, 2006 Large Engineering Systems Conference, Halifax, NS, 2006, pp.165–171. doi: 10.1109/LESCPE.2006.280382. 6. Jialong Wang; Hamilton, R., “Analysis of Transformer Inrush Current and Comparison of Harmonic Restraint Methods in Transformer Protection,” in Protective Relay Engineers, 2008 61st Annual Conference, 2008, pp.142–169. doi: 10.1109/CPRE.2008.4515052 7. AK Steel, “Grain Oriented Electrical Steels” (2013): 1-46. 17 Apr. 2013.

The no load losses are the core losses and they affect how the machine responds to transient loads and thus its load losses.

Get some rest....

TTYL
Hubert

[Clugh]

Hi,
The other Kontronics P650 motor for Mike is thermally potted and terminated. The p650's for the TDRs are 13 turn parallel wyes. Their Kv is 780 and they have 32% more copper than a factory pyro 650 and just a tad bit more than the competition black pyros they came in as. They were 620 Kv. They are still nice and light and I know they can hit < 5 Kw a piece for longer than the 2 sec peaks scorpions rates at.


The wires are nicely secured with the TC2810 3M thermally conductive epoxy as you can see. The wye bundles cleanly soldered with Kester 96.5% silver no clean solder. Each motor received 3 new orange seal ceramic hybrids. I have another 6 pyro 600s sitting here the F3A pilots are waiting for. I have to do then I'm back on Ralph azz with the P800 hybrid while still looking for the 20 pole wundermotor to show up running somewhere with data to put in "incorrect calculators"........



Thanks for your subscription,
🖤Hubert

[Clugh]

But I'm also going to Contact Brian this week to prepare 2 of my ABC 1818's and 2 of 1918's and show you empirically how well the Align that gives you nightmares will push the 1/8th scale hydro that it was wound for. You are truly crazy if you think my fast electric girls wont scoot with it!!! I'm going to drag my son down to a remote cove on Jordan lake and pull the throttle on the Futaba 10PX with GPS just for you a few times. Watch me do it....

I got ya proxy war covered. You are going to lose.

Thanks
Hubert

[Clugh]

"I don't understand this!
how can losses, which become higher with higher load be included in I o?"
~ Ralph Okon~ May 14, 2022, 12:28 PM






~Eaton~
References 1. Bean, R.L., Crackan, N., Moore, H.R., and Wentz, E. (1959). Transformers for the electric power industry. New York: McGraw-Hill. 2. IEEE Std 389 (1996) IEEE Recommended Practice for Testing Electronics Transformers and Inductors, American National Standard (ANSI). 3. CFR Title 10 Chapter II Part 431, Appendix A of Subpart K Distribution Transformers (2016). http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-dx?SID= 9e1d79536391f4253d35753871479988&mc= true&node=pt10.3.431&rgn=div5#sp10.3.431.k 4. L.F. Blume, A. Boyajian, G. Camilli, T.C. Lennox, S. Minneci, V.M. Montsinger (1951). Transformer Engineering. New York: John Wiley & Sons. 5. K. Al-khalifah and E. F. El-saadany, “Investigation of Magnetizing Inrush Current in a Single-Phase Transformer,” Power Engineering, 2006 Large Engineering Systems Conference, Halifax, NS, 2006, pp.165–171. doi: 10.1109/LESCPE.2006.280382. 6. Jialong Wang; Hamilton, R., “Analysis of Transformer Inrush Current and Comparison of Harmonic Restraint Methods in Transformer Protection,” in Protective Relay Engineers, 2008 61st Annual Conference, 2008, pp.142–169. doi: 10.1109/CPRE.2008.4515052 7. AK Steel, “Grain Oriented Electrical Steels” (2013): 1-46. 17 Apr. 2013.

The no load losses are the core losses and they affect how the machine responds to transient loads and thus its load losses.

Get some rest....

TTYL
Hubert

Ich sehe, der Glatzkopf in Dresden hat nichts zu sagen und ist heute nicht so eingesperrt. Was blamierst du dich vor deinen Freunden, weil du die Leerlaufverluste nicht verstehst. Wie alle echten Ingenieure, nicht Bastler, die an den Theorien eines anderen festhalten, die sie täglich falsch darstellen.

[Clugh]

Mike P's #2 is complete and looks like a twin bruder.

Ya'll boys know this Joker in Dresden Germany is nothing but a greedy hater right?

Its okay...😁 he can go view twin "hype" in the TDR flight's in a few weeks.

The Kv is dead on the castle with medium timing. 778

Get ready for the Diablo & my TRON sucka..... You know its clean work you're just a hater....

[Clugh]

Look at Pinocchio and his bruder just learning about idle current today....
Quiet as hell on the GSM.. ALL DAY!!!
No Cap.....

[Clugh]

Up next. These 3 P600 for another F3A pilot with 3 Brenner contra drives. They get the full rebuild. I also ordered a few sport and pylon props and the 7X10 APC. I'll turn it up the speed and the loads on my own projects .

I'm not shy like.......

[Clugh]

[Clugh]

"I don't understand this!
how can losses, which become higher with higher load be included in I o?"
~ Ralph Okon~ May 14, 2022, 12:28 PM






~Eaton~
References 1. Bean, R.L., Crackan, N., Moore, H.R., and Wentz, E. (1959). Transformers for the electric power industry. New York: McGraw-Hill. 2. IEEE Std 389 (1996) IEEE Recommended Practice for Testing Electronics Transformers and Inductors, American National Standard (ANSI). 3. CFR Title 10 Chapter II Part 431, Appendix A of Subpart K Distribution Transformers (2016). http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-dx?SID= 9e1d79536391f4253d35753871479988&mc= true&node=pt10.3.431&rgn=div5#sp10.3.431.k 4. L.F. Blume, A. Boyajian, G. Camilli, T.C. Lennox, S. Minneci, V.M. Montsinger (1951). Transformer Engineering. New York: John Wiley & Sons. 5. K. Al-khalifah and E. F. El-saadany, “Investigation of Magnetizing Inrush Current in a Single-Phase Transformer,” Power Engineering, 2006 Large Engineering Systems Conference, Halifax, NS, 2006, pp.165–171. doi: 10.1109/LESCPE.2006.280382. 6. Jialong Wang; Hamilton, R., “Analysis of Transformer Inrush Current and Comparison of Harmonic Restraint Methods in Transformer Protection,” in Protective Relay Engineers, 2008 61st Annual Conference, 2008, pp.142–169. doi: 10.1109/CPRE.2008.4515052 7. AK Steel, “Grain Oriented Electrical Steels” (2013): 1-46. 17 Apr. 2013.

The no load losses are the core losses and they affect how the machine responds to transient loads and thus its load losses.

Get some rest....

TTYL
Hubert

Die Peanut Gallery in Dresden hat nichts zu sagen. Ich hatte gehofft, ich würde mit ein paar weiteren albernen Antworten aus der Ferne aufwachen, über die ich lachen könnte. Was für ein seltsamer deutscher Ingenieur, der die Auswirkungen von Leerlaufverlusten auf seine 69%- und bifilare Maschine nicht versteht.

Merken Sie, wie unwissend Sie in elektronischer Hinsicht sind?


Got ya! again,,,, "expert" 😁

Hubert

[Clugh]

Anyways i ordered 3 props from APC

7x10
8x10
8x9.25

I meant to get the 8x9.75 ill pick it up next go round but these are on the way.

I'm also receiving 2 raw stacks of the 5340 cobra. I plan to give the 5050 hell with it.

[Clugh]

.Lets see what my power dwarf p600 can do with it....If Mr Nelson himself is still around I should contact him and have him teach me everything about thee props and the power they truly require From what i understand he doesn't give a **** about forums or the AMA now. I think Jimmy said Mr Nelson said they regulated him right out of the sport but Mike Langlois boys are still doing it in Liberty NC I suppose. Jimmy was teaching them and Mike the chroming and honing process for the Nelson long strokes cylinders. Jimmy gave me all the information to how to do it and photos of the rig and how to make it long ago. Jimmy saw my electric motors and told me "Hugh you need to go with that" but i have all the information and direction for alot of the IC stuff. He gave me ALOT! James was Henry Nelsons brother that's no cap. Henry was the only one that really had indication Jim was in bad health. No one else knew. Not even me. James invited me several times to his home and like a fool i never found the time to get over there working alot of overtime at Daimler... That was one of the biggest engineering mistakes of my life. James could have SHOWN me versus manuals and prints.

DUMM

[Clugh]

Ralph really doesn't know all and who I've been exposed to in hobby. ALOT of my friends are deep in this game.
Not one respects ignorance and fallacy as a legitimate proxy war. Dr Okon is clueless. Here are the chrome and honed Nelson sleeves.
JA taught me the process Ralph.

U dont know much about any of this but I love your editorials on me.....

[Clugh]

I def plan to use alot of what Jim taught me on my RM 250 like the toroidal head button. JA also taught me and incredible amount about a ball bearing and building billet connecting rods and such from scratch on manual equipment/ it's a lot more to a ball bearing than an ABEC rating but Ralph trumps it all with his 5 dollar NMB so what can I tell him?

Thats cap.

People like James Allen and Henry Nelson don't need no damn CNC or 3DP either. Manual MASTERS!!!!!
What does the GSM and raggedy lathe in Dresden know about it? He never knew them or Mike Langlois
These are the people I miss because they can speak the language. Ralph Okon doesn't know anything that even interest me!
A hardheaded fool I cant help with anything in electronics.

[Clugh]

I could Tell Ralph Jimmy was passing me along things he was learning from Jan Thiel but Ralph Okon and 90% of a hobby forum hasnt a clue who Jan Thiel is in 2 stroke motors. They can google the many times 2 stroke world champions and Aprilla GP crew chief.....from Europe!!!

For instance there are certain tolerances and tapers in a Nelson that if they aren't cut right to the tightest tolerance and correct number the motors lubrications system will not perform at all like Mr Nelson....But neway.....

Ralph and his German hobbyist friends on a forum think they know everything. But they do not know me or these people I mention outside of spectating.

talking about "strange American engineering calculations" boy you better close your ignorant mouth...

You are not even part of any real conversations we have about it and never worked a place in it in your life.


TTYL
Hubert

[Clugh]

You better get ya sht together at 69% because Lucien is going to supply me a few raw stacks. i don't need but 50 - 100 reliable motors at most to take your custom 5050 out. That saga will be over in a few. It will fit the hyper speed and typhoons for your friends too.

But you gone say you are retired again......
But still Beware. A Flussperren or UETW pilot might emerge.

[Clugh]

A 20 Turn DD will be 320Kv....

[Clugh]

My advice is dont be dumb especially for the youths sake on your forum. . Take Christian up on his ideas like his 20 pole. Its a good one. The knowledge he brings over years you can never get back if you lose it. You should develop the proper cut for it with almost closed slot so it can fit the copper. An apd or modern 6 step inverter can keep up with its without a problem. Its a great match for an APD and you do not need FOC for it to work well. I can proved you that if that's your hang up anyway.

Ralph is wrong. The pole count and slot count don't have to be close. to have a great machine or you wouldn't have a 24 slot 8 pole at Xnova powering awesome Helis all over the globe. Tareq knows. I'd like to see Christian version complete because he set things up nicely when he wants too. Max 4 blade prop may do better using Christian's machine. It would make 7% more torque at any amperage than Ralphs 14 pole. I really want to see it run. Maybe ill manufacture a small run in composite materials and soft magnetics to get on Ralphs last nerve.

A 12N4P isn't a particularly close ratio either....