Alternative motor windings and drive schemes

[Clugh]

The 12 turn pyro is complete and ready to test. the Kv should be between 850-900 . 880 was the target. It is a parallel wye in 200 C TEMCO 17 AWG magnet wire (1.21 mm diameter measured) . An easy wind. The parallel motor terminals are twisted and fused with Kester silver solder all the way to the connectors There is no insulation under the hood on the pigtails or wires Everything is potted with the TC2810 thermally conductive epoxy from 3M made for bonding motor coils. The 3 ceramic hybrids are installed as is the intermediate hardened steel shaft to tie the 3 bearings together axially.

Nothing Hubertus!

Hubert

[Clugh]

Happy new years from America. Please pray for us.

Hubert

[Clugh]

Looks like your boy in Bayern pulled the ejector seat Ralph!

You know that's hilarious...

Happy Harmonics,
pocboi....

[Clugh]

From the kitchen lab. Castle Log 4.839 kW @ 158 amperes. The APC 12X4 truly loads it on 8s Lipo. It can pull it harder I bet as I did this at 15* timing. This is significantly above the power consumption levels the pilot expects to see in his application. These are peak values even though I think i could squeeze a little more. It did the 4.8 kW for 5 seconds. That's enough to test for a customer. No need to be cute. Looks like the peak efficiency would be around 60 amperes. The gearbox is a 7:1 will free it up alot.. It will probably see around 24,000 rpm on the gearbox and counter rotating 23 x 20 props. The freeload at 34 volts should be around 28,322



Pyro 650-83
6+6 parallel wye 17 AWG.
Kv 833
Rm 14.05 milliohms
Io 1.6 amps at 16.3 volts @ 15* timing

Thank you for your time and patience,
Hubert

[Clugh]

Now ill try to get around a 1000 watt load on it and record rise in bell temperatures over time. My spark fun Artemus open datalogger has FLIR capabilities as well.

[Clugh]

Thu, Jan 16 at 9:56 PM

"CK Aero is going to offer a motor in the spring that will be very similar to the motor that Bert was making. Hubert custom wind Kontronik Pyro 600 motors so they perform as well as, or better, than Bert’s motors. I flew one of these motors all through 2024. They are the real deal. The motor that I flew was the most efficient motor that I have ever run with my V4. This will be a Contra V4 Motor that is able to deliver up to 3.8kW when used with 23” Falcon Contra Props. This is actually more power than is needed for F3A. The excess power is intended to be used in conjunction with a constant rpm D3 ESC to provide reserve power that the ESC can use to maintain constant speed through maneuvers

If you are interested, contact Bryan at CK Aero and he can put you on the list for one of these new motors".

~Brenner Contra Drives~

The motor that Bryan is going to offer will have better quality, better reliability, and better performance than Bert’s motors for these reasons:

I hand wind each motor with a custom winding to get better fill into each motor. I pot the motors with a thermally conductive compound that increases the heat transfer from the core. This also prevents the windings from moving due to magnet forces and help prevent the wire shorting out over time. I replace the bearings with ceramic hybrids plated with Tungsten Disulfide Dry lube, which will allow the bearings to run dry if the bearing grease dries up. This should extent the life of the bearings considerably. The wire has polyamide insulation rated to 250C* The rotor magnets are stable to 150C* the dry lube is stable to 600C. The potting compound is stable to 200C.

CKAero - Fly with the Best

Thank you,
Hubert

[Clugh]

If you dont have one handy this is a helpful tool for plotting and graphing data. It will regress the function that you put in the math cell of excel. I think for tablets you may be able to get a MATLAB

https://ti84calc.com/ti84calc

[Clugh]

Without fallacy I guess there was nothing left...

[Clugh]

Hey, werdet ihr es mit so etwas wie Kohlefaserkeilen versuchen oder werdet ihr einfach hier sitzen und starren? Der Verrückte ist nach Tatooine zurückgekehrt. Ich habe mich eingehender mit dem Thema befasst und es hat eine geringe Permeabilität. Ich weiß nicht genau, was es ist, aber etwa 2,5 Mu ergeben ein gutes Gleichgewicht zwischen der Reduzierung von Leerlauf- und Laststrom, ohne das Ausgangsdrehmoment zu verringern. Maschenweite und Dicke wirken sich auf die Abschirmeigenschaften aus. Ihr müsst es wirklich ausprobieren, da die Magnetverluste hauptsächlich durch das Umschalten des Reglers entstehen und ich glaube nicht, dass FEM diese durch den Regler verursachten Magnetverluste erfasst.

Da Kohlenstofffasern nicht magnetisch sind, weisen sie eine geringe magnetische Permeabilität auf. Aufgrund dieser Eigenschaft eignen sich Kohlenstofffasern für den Einsatz in Bereichen, in denen magnetische Interferenzen minimiert werden müssen.

[Clugh]

Die Führer haben nichts zu sagen???

[Clugh]

I built one 30 years ago😶 But it used a toggle switch that would allow me to throw the servo 180 degrees in both directions. Ive also seen this circuit modified with a thermistor in place of the pot and then control the servo position based on temperature. IC tuners proposed using it in the exhaust gas to trim a servo controlled 3rd needle into Lamda operation with the nitro motor. Simple circuitry every engineer would have built one or something similar in a classroom environment at some point in their academic curriculum. The one I built In the 90's was used in a motorization circuit in a high end car audio install. This is before automation became standard in high end vehicles...

There's a plethora of cute devices like signal generators that can be built with the NEC 555 IC timer. I have to look around and see if i can find the 30 plus year old device. There are whole books dedicated to designing simple circuits around this particular IC.

You can show the circuit to your friends.

Its only a fun circuit to build. By the time you gather all the parts, time, solder and effort its worth it to just buy a servo saver. They are so cheap and abundant these days.

Hubert

[Clugh]

Wow, it's really amazing how a good technical answer to a lot of misunderstandings and personal attacks has also taken German social media by storm. What's the matter, "brother"? And what are your plans? As always, or will Ralph and Thomas develop better engines? Everything has been explained to them, so what are they waiting for? To the return of the Lord? Or is 69% and the standard HK average enough with a BLAC sine wave inverter? Is it obvious yet what the optimal drive and motor combinations should be? Or is it your destiny to continue run a mis matched power system or run with in general ideas about FOC commutation.?



YT
Hubert

[Clugh]

Good morning Okon I see you

Yesterday I received the other competition black 650. They are short shaft 65's and he want 78's with longer shaft. I think a 14 turns will put him there. For new shafts ill use Luke's ejector pins in 6mm x 100mm. And see if I can come about some 16.5 AWG. I could do the larger wire Delta but I want to see what inverter he runs first. I already started to strip one of the motors but haven't measured the conductor yet. Itz certainly a delta wind OEM.

Color: Silver Tone

• HRC: 55-58rc
• Material: SKD61
• Surface Treatment: Quenched; Tempered
• Shank Diameter: 6mm/ 0.24"
• Head Diameter: 10mm/ 0.39"
• Head Thickness: 6mm/ 0.24"
• Total Length: 100mm/ 4"

$13.85 with free shipping. You know where it ships from so the price will raise by 10% soon.

[Clugh]

About the HK5. No one wants one with 69% for 1000 euros no matter how many times church members there solicit it, teaming it with the wrong drive also still makes zero sense Ralph THE BLDC motor only runs right at wot with a YGE and it still loses its magnet so the HK5's will see you again soon with the grill marks in anything but a Heli that doesn't spend alot of time at full power.

Please post the HK 3026 plots and motor constants with a YGE data log along with your claims. The pyros do more. You know that too...

[Clugh]

Competition Black Kontronics Pyro 650's
WattsStax

HK 4020 V3PYRO 650

Love Always🖤
P.O.C.B.O.I.

[Clugh]

A few words from a heli pilot about his experience with the two machines he wound himself.

"First 2 flights with the P650 went fine and I was happy with the performance, it pulled really nice in my opinion. However around the 3rd flight into a big powerloop "oh oh hard shutdown" and landed with a burn mark in the side of the esc.Long story short: Kontronik tested my P650 which was 100% fine, and I got myself a Kosmik 160HV again.Did about 20 flights on it and the power is simply amazing for the size of the motor. Also the Kosmik really does perform better, the Jive Pro simply did not feel that good with this motor. I am so happy with this 650 that I sold my tuned 4235 ''NickMaxDekker' and also a tuned P700 that I had planned for this heli. Oh and the motor runs really really cool I love it. I feel no difference in power compared to a tuned P700.The tuned 4235 perhaps had a bit more oomph under 1800rpm but with the P650 the E700 feels more alive and responsive."

~ POWER Dekker~

[Clugh]

"Die ersten beiden Flüge mit dem P650 verliefen gut und ich war mit der Leistung zufrieden, er zog meiner Meinung nach wirklich gut. Beim dritten Flug hatte ich jedoch eine große Leistungsschleife, „oh oh, hartes Herunterfahren“ und ich landete mit einem Brandfleck an der Seite des ESC. Lange Rede, kurzer Sinn, Kontronik testete meinen P650, der 100 % in Ordnung war, und ich kaufte wieder einen Kosmik 160HV. Ich machte ungefähr 20 Flüge damit und die Leistung ist für die Größe des Motors einfach erstaunlich. Außerdem ist die Leistung des Kosmik wirklich besser, der Jive Pro fühlte sich mit diesem Motor einfach nicht so gut an. Ich bin mit diesem 650 so zufrieden, dass ich meinen getunten 4235 „NickMaxDekker“ und auch einen getunten P700 verkauft habe, den ich für diesen Hubschrauber geplant hatte. Oh, und der Motor läuft wirklich cool, ich liebe ihn. Ich spüre keinen Leistungsunterschied im Vergleich zu einem getunten P700. Der getunte 4235 hätte unter 1800 U/min vielleicht etwas mehr Leistung gehabt, aber mit dem P650 fühlt sich der E700 lebendiger und reaktionsschneller an."

~ Power Dekker~



A Nick Maxwell 4235 weighs nearly double a P650 which worked better and more efficiently in the applicable ranges.

Thx
Hubert

[Clugh]

Hey Ralph,
He is back under a new profile. Lets see where it surfaces. Check my boat threads. The last hope is to hold on to JAGS....even though they are not in any way affiliated and actually say from what they know you're a good guy....

A sinus is still a sinus.

check the list....😁

TTYL
Hubert

[Clugh]

We can have another discussion there about sinus power versus BLDC

[Clugh]

Hi,
Because I need my PCB mill workspace back I have to build a dedicated stand to test the engines. I need my space back to show angry birds how to build a few BLDC drives. Closed and open loop. The speed clan should enjoy it even though they cannot even wind the hybrids yet but request drive school from the USA....



Thank you for your time and patience,
Hubert