Official Freewing 90mm F-4 Phantom II Thread

[Woodcock]

Wow, I think Freewing & Flightline models are pretty good models. For what your paying they are right up at the top of the foamy tree. Then I think Dynam are good models too, usually more issues to sort thru than others, but once sorted they fly great, IMO. I like you DG refrain from purchasing E-flight most of the time. I have more than a few E-flight models, I just seem to always have QC issues with them. Their QC sucks, and they don't like to paint the white foam. I like my white foam painted white.

I think Motions planes are as good as any, their paint and detailing are as good as any of the nicer model, maybe a little better than some. I have many of their models, and have been satisfied for the most part. I don't put them on some type of fictitious pedestal, HK offers great products too. My fleet consists of about 30% HK, 25%Motion, 40% Dynam, 5% other stuff. Sort of. But to say Motion products are generally poor quality, is untrue in my regard. They are as good as any.

These type of molding anomalies happen. It happens with all of the lines. Some more than others some less. Motion would be less for sure.

In regards to this particular Phantom model in question, I'm pretty sure Motion would have sorted this for you, had you ask. If you did ask, and they refused? We should probably discuss this a little further.

Woody

[ICM]

I have 14 planes, 6 E-flite, 4 FMS, 4 Freewing/Flightline. In my experience quality on all has been very good with perhaps a slight nod to Freewing/Flightline. I did have 2 Dynams . DOA servos and retract, ill fitting and missing parts, sloppy paint and glue jobs. Flew ok once sorted out but I sold them. Not worth the delays and aggravation.

[Waconut]

I am new to EDF, I have been a long time (30 years) kit and scratch builder. I am impressed with the value of the Freewing planes. I have purchased 5 jets since January and no major issues at all. You could not begin to build a EDF for what you can buy a Freewing for.

[themudduck]

Like others here, I have a fairly large collection of Freewing planes, and I have some other brands including some Horizon and Dynam models and the LX B-25. As a club instructor, I have flown many other models as well.

What's really different about Freewing is that the design supervisor (Alpha) is an avid model pilot. And he participates on these forums! Its easy to see the difference in the design engineering, the way the planes are thought out and the way they are ready by the time they are put on the market. Freewing models are light, strong, engineered well, and generally have a good fit and finish. Regarding quality - well unlike some other planes, I've never had to replace bad servos, or glue in flap hinges, and I've never had missing kit parts. I like the way the major components (wings, servos, tail parts) are removeable with well-thought out features like hard points, and the way the boxes have all the parts cradled and bagged. And spare parts are available!! Having my Dynam B26 arrive with no packing material, so that the accessories carton bashed up the fuselage from bouncing around inside the box, was a turnoff. Its obvious when a company is not being run by modelers.

With the F4, I really didn't like the elevator servo, they should have definitely beefed up the pushrod connection and the servo mount. But... like I said, not every model is going to be perfect.

With several years of experience with FW models I must say that in general, I am really not impressed much with forum contributors who publicly blame the plane for their poor flying or "dumb thumbs", or condemn the entire company when they experience a problem with one model. I agree with Woodcock, if you got a wing with a warp (because the factory screwed up) if you let Motion know about it they will stand behind it and you can get a replacement. So to me, the whole package is important - this may not sink in if you haven't experienced a lot of other brands. FW isn't perfect but I would definitely say they are "better than most" in MANY aspects. They definitely aren't a junk brand, not by a long shot. Like I said, when someone says something like that I just sigh and roll my eyes. Just like at the field when someone crashes because they are a poor pilot and they say "that plane is a POS, it doesn't fly good!". Yeah... right!

[Phantom]

If it weren't for FW's models, I probably wouldn't have any EDF's in my fleet, or very few... Prior to my purchase of there 80mm F-86 in 2015, I was very disillusioned with PNP EDF's. If I purchased an EDF before that time, I would do so with the mindset of expecting tons of issues out of the box, and the power systems were all such crap that before the plane even reached me I had already shopped for it's it's power system replacement.

I own HSD, FLEX, HK, LX, Dynam, FMS, Jepe and a few EDF's from companies I'm sure none but the most avid jet junkies would have heard of. But the bulk of my EDF's which now make of more than 50% of my fleet of aircraft are from Freewing. They are one of the few companies I feel make a fly right out of the box jet. There are a few QC issues here and there like my T-33 80mm, that flies like a dream but seems to flake paint off like a molting bird haha.

I don't give this praise lightly, I own about 90% of all 70mm to 90mm FW EDF's that have been manufactured or been available for sale since 2015. In my Opinion, there QC, and bang for your buck has been the major contributing factor for raising other manufacturers quality of EDF's such as FMS, Eflight and Dynam.

[Beeg]

I love Freewing models!

[Hugh Wiedman]

I love Freewing models!

Me three! When I first started out flying several years ago, I started with E-Flight planes and also got several FMS planes, all props. I wasn't greatly impressed with the quality, but thought for foamy planes and a few bucks, who's complaining. I spent as much time fixing them (from pilot errors) as flying them, if not more. My first FW and first EDF was the Stinger 90 and I had some serious deficiencies in my flying ability (not so sure that has changed much) that gave me a tough time with it (always going way too fast and sometimes loosing orientation). But even then, I recognized the fine quality of FW in comparison to most of the others.

Since then, I've moved on with the Spitfire/Corsair/B-24/Avanti S/F-4/F-16/F-18 and have to say, considering the relatively inexpensive cost for what you get, I think they are the best bang for your buck. Considering how many models FW has to put out to keep us all happy and the amount of hand work that also goes into them (Alpha's video look into manufacturing was a real eye opener), it's amazing how it seems 99% or better are first rate. And anytime there seems to be even a minor issue, Motion & FW have stepped up to the plate. I'm surprised there aren't more issues considering the numbers and how labor intensive these are to turn out, and for what I think is a great price. I'm sure they could put top of the line servos, hardware, etc. into them, but then they'd have to charge an arm and a leg for it and we'd be moaning how expensive these are. My other favorite planes are the Extreme Flight 3D planes, but by the time you've installed high quality servo's, ESC's, motors, hardware and wood props, a $350 ARF turns into closer to $900, but IMO, it's well worth it, for those types of planes. For the foam prop planes and EDF's, I'm sticking with FW and am "pleased as punch". Hey, everyone is entitled to their likes and dislikes, but options are a great thing to have. And no one's stopping us from spending any extra bucks to upgrade whatever we feel is warranted, so Motion/FW/FL, keep 'em coming baby, you sure know how to keep my bank account hoppin'.

[paulsnapp]

Has anyone out there been to HomeDepot or Lowe's and had the paint colors for the F4 matched for touch up paint? If so, would you mind sharing the label formulas? I have other Flightline planes that the paint match formulas have been shared on this forum and they were exact matches. Thanks for any help!

[Hugh Wiedman]

paulsnapp assume you mean the camo version. Got these a couple years ago at Home Depot in the flat/matte and they were a good match. Can't remember if I got them myself or from ones that were posted by someone else (which I think was the case) , but these should work well for you.

The first 2 are the green and dark green, then the next 2 are the grey (underside) and brown. Enjoy!

[paulsnapp]

Hugh - thanks so much, I really appreciate it!!

[The43rdHammer]

Maidened my F-4 today, 4-flights and up until the final landing no issues at all. I love this plane. Our runway is a little uneven and I think I hit a bump in it, shame as you’ll see from the video I was coming in nice and nose high, but the bump hit the mains and forced the nose wheel into the turf. Nobody’s fault, if Patrick sees this I’d appreciate his view? Take care all

[Mizer67]

Maidened my F-4 today, 4-flights and up until the final landing no issues at all. I love this plane. Our runway is a little uneven and I think I hit a bump in it, shame as you’ll see from the video I was coming in nice and nose high, but the bump hit the mains and forced the nose wheel into the turf. Nobody’s fault, if Patrick sees this I’d appreciate his view? Take care all

I'm not Patrick, but if you slow down the playback speed on Youtube to .25 in the settings, you can see the mains never touched down first. Assuming you were still holding back pressure, it looks like a stall which caused the nose to drop and to hit nose gear first and then the plane to porpoise.

If you tried to force the nose down to get the plane to land, given you were 2/3rds down the runway, or even just relaxed your back pressure, that's another recipe for a porpoise also.

[The43rdHammer]

I'm not Patrick, but if you slow down the playback speed on Youtube to .25 in the settings, you can see the mains never touched down first. Assuming you were still holding back pressure, it looks like a stall which caused the nose to drop and to hit nose gear first and then the plane to porpoise.

If you tried to force the nose down to get the plane to land, given you were 2/3rds down the runway, or even just relaxed your back pressure, that's another recipe for a porpoise also.

I may have released the back pressure as I was running out of room, I seem to recall it crossing my mind 😬

Typical isn’t it, as soon as the camera of death comes out you spam it 🤣

[DCORSAIR]

That was a case of a forced landing, running out of runway and wanting to get it on the ground to stop...........

I can remember when I figured out how to land the F-4, get the approach speed right and the flaps and elevator mix right, she will reward you nice and slow.

Not bragging on my landing by the way, just wanted to show you what she can do.

https://youtu.be/u7LeAGS_BEc

[Hugh Wiedman]

DCORSAIR Ain't braggin if you got the proof to back it up! Nice flight and picture perfect landing. I wanna fly like you when I grow up (oops, too late for that). Don't feel bad The43rdHammer , I think we've all done that at one time or another as well. Seems to me the F-4 has a narrow window between stall speed and perfect landing speed, but 3 out of 4 on the maiden is a decent start (for me anyway, I was at 50% when I first started flying the F-4, only my 2nd EDF).

[The43rdHammer]

That was a case of a forced landing, running out of runway and wanting to get it on the ground to stop...........

I can remember when I figured out how to land the F-4, get the approach speed right and the flaps and elevator mix right, she will reward you nice and slow.

Not bragging on my landing by the way, just wanted to show you what she can do.

https://youtu.be/u7LeAGS_BEc

Wow ... that was one of the best scale jet landings I’ve seen ... please feel free to brag 🤣🤣🤣

[Mizer67]

I may have released the back pressure as I was running out of room, I seem to recall it crossing my mind 😬

Typical isn’t it, as soon as the camera of death comes out you spam it 🤣

Happens to the best of us. I spent the last few year pre-Corona flying full scale. There was a prop strike at my home drome every ~4-5 months from someone in a slippery bird (for example a Mooney) or a student pilot running out of runway and trying to force it to land by pushing the nose down, causing a porpoise then usually a nose gear collapse and prop. strike. It's a contributing factor flying too fast then crossing the fence at several times Vso.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1fFrEuuMF8

I find some aspects of R/C more difficult, in that we don't have the benefit of instruments. The best way to prevent this type of thing is to be precise in your airspeed. If you're not down in the first third of the runway, go around. They're free and no one ever complains about more flying time.

[The43rdHammer]

Happens to the best of us. I spent the last few year pre-Corona flying full scale. There was a prop strike at my home drome every ~4-5 months from someone in a slippery bird (for example a Mooney) or a student pilot running out of runway and trying to force it to land by pushing the nose down, causing a porpoise then usually a nose gear collapse and prop. strike. It's a contributing factor flying too fast then crossing the fence at several times Vso.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1fFrEuuMF8

I find some aspects of R/C more difficult, in that we don't have the benefit of instruments. The best way to prevent this type of thing is to be precise in your airspeed. If you're not down in the first third of the runway, go around. They're free and no one ever complains about more flying time.

I’d agree with all of that, and its interesting to hear its an issue for full size aircraft as well.

The one thing I’d say is that you get precious little time with an EDF battery so sometimes you may be on the fuel threshold when considering a go-around.

I didn’t quite appreciate how much the F-4 wants to fly when you get that nose up around 15 degrees.

I think next time I’ll bring her in at a steeper angle with the nose up. I also noticed that I lost quite a bit if aileron authority with full flaps down (some models do this I know - some don’t) so I’ll be mostly using the rudder on approach.

No major damage done, I snapped the nose gear pin and broke a gear door, but thats all.

[DCORSAIR]

I’d agree with all of that, and its interesting to hear its an issue for full size aircraft as well.

The one thing I’d say is that you get precious little time with an EDF battery so sometimes you may be on the fuel threshold when considering a go-around.

I didn’t quite appreciate how much the F-4 wants to fly when you get that nose up around 15 degrees.

I think next time I’ll bring her in at a steeper angle with the nose up. I also noticed that I lost quite a bit if aileron authority with full flaps down (some models do this I know - some don’t) so I’ll be mostly using the rudder on approach.

No major damage done, I snapped the nose gear pin and broke a gear door, but thats all.

You did a great job on that flight, I only posted my vidoe to maybe help you on your approach speed, looks like you have plenty of room on your approach to take your time, you don't have much room for error though as far as your runway goes, its tight.

[The43rdHammer]

You did a great job on that flight, I only posted my vidoe to maybe help you on your approach speed, looks like you have plenty of room on your approach to take your time, you don't have much room for error though as far as your runway goes, its tight.

Absolutely, and thank you, I loved your video and will be using it as a reference for the future.

I meant to ask, is your Phantom 8s or 6s?