Freewing 90mm F-22 Raptor - Official Thread

[T-CAT]

Got a nice quick sunset sortie in this evening...I noticed a pretty pronounced tail waggle on my passes...You can most definitely see it in the video. Any of you aerodynamic folks have any ideas for the cause? I haven't noticed it before...

Although the vertical stab. flex doesn't have me worried as it's likely secured well and appears to occur within reasonable amounts, but its it's worth checking the mounting tabs on each of them, on the vertical and fuselage. It makes me curious if gluing the vertical stabs into the fuselage (and still use the screws of course) would allow less flex of those tall and massive vertical surfaces. Around the 55 second to 1:05 minute mark in the video shows the flex well. It is likely aerodynamic factors causing the yaw most, but it's not helping that the vertical stabilizer bases are moving as that could have potential to alter the severity of the yaw action.

[Aros]

Wow that really was pronounced! I am definitely going to take a look at those mount tabs...I will glue those suckers in as well if need be. Thanks for pointing that out!

[T-CAT]

Great flying and video by the way!

[downwindleg]

Alright, I am going to level with you guys . We RC guys,at this level, have two hats. The builder of the plane and the flyer of the plane.Today the builder of the plane blew it in a major way, me, and the flyer of the plane, me again, did everything he could to compensate for the builder. Here's a shot of the plane before the maiden. Twothirds of the stress we feel on the maiden is due to wondering if we overlooked something and onethird is due to wondering whether we can react fast enough to compensate for the other twothirds!! Anyway, thought I had everything covered but on takeoff, to my horror:Scared: realized that I had not set the ailerons to factory settings like the other surfaces, and had way too much throw on the ailerons and not really enough,by the book, on the elevators. It was a struggle to maintain control and the flaps made it even worse.:Scared::Scared: Long story short, I crashed on landing. Had to do the "walk of shame". Tore out one main gear and bent the foam pocket for the nose gear back and tore away part of the port inlet shroud. Several other minor issues. Already fixed most of the problems but the nose gear might be a challenge. Wish you could buy separate ailerons without buying the whole wing. Any way, I see from parts orders on this and many other MRC planes that people tend to just quietly order replacement parts, me included, without admitting they crashed or damaged one so I had to come clean. Luckily, none of my mods were effected.:Cool:

[Hardway]

:(:(:(:(:(:( It will be OK, but my heart is with you Bro...…….. :Cool:

[Aros]

Great flying and video by the way!

Thanks man, it was a decent flight minus the tail wagging! ;)

[Aros]

Ah Brad sorry to hear that my man. Ugh. I know all the work you put into her before the maiden. I guess the one positive is that it's not a total loss, that you can have her back in the air with a part or two....I feel your pain brother!!

[downwindleg]

Thank you, Thank you,Thank you for the kind words my friends. I'm over the initial shock and now thinking of how to move forward. Parts vs fixes. Amazing how one dumb oversight can make the difference between sad and happy landings. I may have to wait 'til I've paid for the shipping on the P-38 and the P-51 before more parts can come.

[RichJ53]

[QUOTE=Aros.MotionRC;n191099]Got a nice quick sunset sortie in this evening...I noticed a pretty pronounced tail waggle on my passes...You can most definitely see it in the video. Any of you aerodynamic folks have any ideas for the cause? I haven't noticed it before.../[QUOTE]

You might check your rudders.... look to see if you them both parallel. Sometimes you can put a little inward or outward tow on the rudders to cure that issue.

Rich

[RichJ53]

Alright, I am going to level with you guys . We RC guys,at this level, have two hats. The builder of the plane and the flyer of the plane.Today the builder of the plane blew it in a major way, me, and the flyer of the plane, me again, did everything he could to compensate for the builder. Here's a shot of the plane before the maiden. Twothirds of the stress we feel on the maiden is due to wondering if we overlooked something and onethird is due to wondering whether we can react fast enough to compensate for the other twothirds!! Anyway, thought I had everything covered but on takeoff, to my horror:Scared: realized that I had not set the ailerons to factory settings like the other surfaces, and had way too much throw on the ailerons and not really enough,by the book, on the elevators. It was a struggle to maintain control and the flaps made it even worse.:Scared::Scared: Long story short, I crashed on landing. Had to do the "walk of shame". Tore out one main gear and bent the foam pocket for the nose gear back and tore away part of the port inlet shroud. Several other minor issues. Already fixed most of the problems but the nose gear might be a challenge. Wish you could buy separate ailerons without buying the whole wing. Any way, I see from parts orders on this and many other MRC planes that people tend to just quietly order replacement parts, me included, without admitting they crashed or damaged one so I had to come clean. Luckily, none of my mods were effected.:Cool:

Sorry to read this! Speedy recovery

Rich

[RCjetdude]

Brad, you are not alone. Every time I think I have covered all my bases I find something I overlooked. I have to be so careful to check everything. Glad the damage was not too severe.

[Aros]

This is so true. Sometimes we think we have gone through everything with a fine brush only to discover we overlooked something, sometimes perhaps what we would think is otherwise obvious. Just tonight I flew my A-10 and on one of my approaches (crazy winds) I didn't even drop my gear. I thought it was dropped and about 25 feet up I was like "OH SH*T!" and had that unglorious go around. Man, if you are in the hobby long enough you can find all kinds of ways to dumb thumb things.

LOL

[Pogo]

Thank you, Thank you,Thank you for the kind words my friends. I'm over the initial shock and now thinking of how to move forward. Parts vs fixes. Amazing how one dumb oversight can make the difference between sad and happy landings. I may have to wait 'til I've paid for the shipping on the P-38 and the P-51 before more parts can come.

That's a huge drag Brad- sorry it happened but glad it wasn't worse. Two things come to mind:
A checklist can be really handy, especially with a new model about to be maidened. Write down what's been done and what's left to do; just jotting stuff down can be helpful in avoiding missed items. That said, mine has yet to leave the ground so who knows what I've missed...:Thinking:
Regarding the damaged nose gear mounting area, I wonder if this would be an ideal opportunity to move it back to the scale location (~3.5"?). F106DeltaDart has been working on that with his, maybe he can chime in.
Tom

[adb2@suddenlink.net]

Alright, I am going to level with you guys . We RC guys,at this level, have two hats. The builder of the plane and the flyer of the plane.Today the builder of the plane blew it in a major way, me, and the flyer of the plane, me again, did everything he could to compensate for the builder. Here's a shot of the plane before the maiden. Twothirds of the stress we feel on the maiden is due to wondering if we overlooked something and onethird is due to wondering whether we can react fast enough to compensate for the other twothirds!! Anyway, thought I had everything covered but on takeoff, to my horror:Scared: realized that I had not set the ailerons to factory settings like the other surfaces, and had way too much throw on the ailerons and not really enough,by the book, on the elevators. It was a struggle to maintain control and the flaps made it even worse.:Scared::Scared: Long story short, I crashed on landing. Had to do the "walk of shame". Tore out one main gear and bent the foam pocket for the nose gear back and tore away part of the port inlet shroud. Several other minor issues. Already fixed most of the problems but the nose gear might be a challenge. Wish you could buy separate ailerons without buying the whole wing. Any way, I see from parts orders on this and many other MRC planes that people tend to just quietly order replacement parts, me included, without admitting they crashed or damaged one so I had to come clean. Luckily, none of my mods were effected.:Cool:

You are way more experienced than I am but I'll pass this along. Of the four Raptors I've been involved with I have not noticed any tail wiggle or any other abnormality. I originally set them up as per recommendations. However as lots of experience has showm me and I have modified some throws. Example I didn't feel I was getting enough elevator throw so I increased that. I also felt aileron travel was to much so I cut that back.Sounds to me like I have had some just dumb luck. For me it is easier to control elevator travel than to run out of needed travel. Just me.

[downwindleg]

You are way more experienced than I am but I'll pass this along. Of the four Raptors I've been involved with I have not noticed any tail wiggle or any other abnormality. I originally set them up as per recommendations. However as lots of experience has showm me and I have modified some throws. Example I didn't feel I was getting enough elevator throw so I increased that. I also felt aileron travel was to much so I cut that back.Sounds to me like I have had some just dumb luck. For me it is easier to control elevator travel than to run out of needed travel. Just me.

Hey adb2, I agree with you about having a little more throw than not enough but I think you might be confusing my issue with the tail waggle issue that Aros was having. Also,thanks for the input and support from everyone on the crash..... Tom, thanks for the input as well. From now on, I will have a premaiden checklist. Funny, I had a checklist for the mods I wanted to do but no premaiden checklist.:Confused:

[Bill Sanford]

Although the vertical stab. flex doesn't have me worried as it's likely secured well and appears to occur within reasonable amounts, but its it's worth checking the mounting tabs on each of them, on the vertical and fuselage. It makes me curious if gluing the vertical stabs into the fuselage (and still use the screws of course) would allow less flex of those tall and massive vertical surfaces. Around the 55 second to 1:05 minute mark in the video shows the flex well. It is likely aerodynamic factors causing the yaw most, but it's not helping that the vertical stabilizer bases are moving as that could have potential to alter the severity of the yaw action.

Do you have a gyro in this? If so, I think your aileron gain might be too high...

[T-CAT]

Do you have a gyro in this? If so, I think your aileron gain might be too high...

This is Aros's plane, but that's a great question that he can answer :).

[T-CAT]

Downwindleg, sorry to hear about the F22. I hope you're back in the air soon. It happens to us all.

[Aros]

No gyro in mine. It sure acted like it had one with the gain too high though...

[downwindleg]

That's a huge drag Brad- sorry it happened but glad it wasn't worse. Two things come to mind:
A checklist can be really handy, especially with a new model about to be maidened. Write down what's been done and what's left to do; just jotting stuff down can be helpful in avoiding missed items. That said, mine has yet to leave the ground so who knows what I've missed...:Thinking:
Regarding the damaged nose gear mounting area, I wonder if this would be an ideal opportunity to move it back to the scale location (~3.5"?). F106DeltaDart has been working on that with his, maybe he can chime in.
Tom

Hey Tom, I'll be interested in what F106DeltaDart comes up with. I'm trying to avoid replacing the fuselage....mainly because I would have to do allot of wire routing for the formation lights and reinstalling the ones below the cockpit. The starboard aileron is pretty beat up too but MRC doesn't sell replacement ailerons......just the whole wings as a pair.