Alternative motor windings and drive schemes

[Clugh]

Hallo Ralph,
Ich sehe, du hast heute um 7:35 Uhr EST Unterricht. Pech für dich, denn ich bin heute nicht in der richtigen Stimmung. Aber mit der 4730-Patrone könnt ihr der HK-45-Serie sicher ernsthafte Konkurrenz machen. Ich weiß, dass du die Website von FRPower besucht hast.

Thomas hat seine Daten veröffentlicht, Ralph! Thomas hat seine Daten veröffentlicht, Ralph! Du und Lukey seid im Vergleich dazu nur noch Nebensache.

Ihr seid zusammen im Schrank.


:ghost:

Hubert

[Clugh]

BTW Fabrizio Russo of FR power has contacted me about tuning his 4730 motor.

FR Power


Der rosa Motor ist auch hässlich Ralph. :see_no_evil:

[Clugh]

Ralph,
Kristina braucht einen besseren Motor und ein besseres Tuning, um in Pink richtig gut auszusehen. Das bestätigt auch, dass sie so schnell nicht schneller fliegen wird. Wenn Piloten neuere, effizientere Wicklungen und Konstruktionstechniken nutzen wollen, werden sie diese in Deutschland wahrscheinlich nicht finden, denn du, Powercroco, bietet nur ungekapselte Stern- oder Dreieckmotoren mit Standard-Stahllagern an. Ihre Materialien stoßen an ihre Grenzen.

Siehst du, diese Motoren zerstören die YGEs auf deiner Werkbank! Sogar deinen speziellen „400“. Du wolltest deinen Freunden wahrscheinlich etwas beweisen, obwohl die Sicherheitsfunktionen deaktiviert waren. Haha, Marian von YGE hat dir gesagt, du sollst es NICHT tun. Du hast es trotzdem getan und den Rauch abbekommen…

Hab ich dir doch gesagt…

Die Platinen sind so ROSA , dass nachträglich noch zusätzliche Stromschienen hinzugefügt werden müssen.

Layta
Hubert

[Clugh]

Hallo,
Kristina braucht einen besseren Motor und Tuner, um in Pink wirklich hübsch auszusehen.

[Clugh]

BTW
The flight card arrived. It is an OmnibusF4SD F4V3S flight controller

Betaflight Filtering 101 - Oscar Liang
Betaflight Filtering 101

What is RPM filter?

Notchfilter sind hochwirksam bei der Rauschunterdrückung und führen zu einer geringeren Signalverzögerung im Vergleich zu Tiefpassfiltern bei gleichem Dämpfungsgrad. Mehr über Filter erfahren Sie in unserem Betaflight Filter 101-Kurs. Die Herausforderung besteht darin, die Spitzenfrequenz des Rauschens zu erfassen. Dynamische Filter können dies zwar relativ gut, erfassen aber nur eine Frequenz. Da die Motoren einer Drohne mit unterschiedlichen Drehzahlen (Umdrehungen pro Minute) rotieren können, erzeugen sie Rauschen mit unterschiedlichen Frequenzen. Der Drehzahlfilter von Betaflight ist ein leistungsstarkes Tool, mit dem der Flugcontroller Ihrer Drohne die Drehzahlen (U/min) Ihrer Motoren über bidirektionales DShot erfassen und eine Reihe von Notchfiltern genau auf diese Frequenz und deren Oberwellen einstellen kann. Diese Funktion hilft, Vibrationen durch Motoren und Propeller zu eliminieren und so die Flugleistung zu verbessern. Dynamischer Filter Seit Betaflight 3.1 gibt es jedoch die Option eines dynamischen Notchfilters namens „Dynamischer Filter“ im Reiter „Konfiguration“. Dieser hochwirksame Notch-Filter ist jetzt standardmäßig in Betaflight aktiviert. Er verfolgt die Motorgeräuschspitze und variiert die Frequenz entsprechend einer Echtzeit-FFT-Analyse. Diese Filter halten Rauschen in der Regel gut fern, wenn Sie die Filterparameter richtig einstellen. Es kann jedoch vorkommen, dass Schwingungen und Rauschen mit unerwarteter Frequenz auftreten, z. B. bei verbogenen Propellern oder verschleißenden Motoren. Hier kommt der dynamische Filter ins Spiel.

Hallo Okon,
Siehst du, wie offensichtlich es ist, dass du und die acht Piloten nicht wissen, was es mit Motorumrichtern und -steuerungen auf sich hat und wie man sie im Speedflying einsetzt? Du solltest mehr lernen, als du schreibst.





Danke
Hubert

[Clugh]

Broski's here's the plane that was built in the video. Man this place looks just like the outer banks in NC. The wind truly is constant there..

https://www.youtube.com/embed/-uVAFEgCV5I?wmode=opaque&start=0

It came out sweet! I like it alot!

[Clugh]

BTW
The flight card arrived. It is an OmnibusF4SD F4V3S flight controller

[Clugh]

Anywho,

Hopefully some of the boys here enjoy this build series on composite model construction. as much as I did.
composite modelling series - YouTube

TTYL
Hubert

[Clugh]

"According to my information, the relatively low price of these plates is due to the fact that not only are the labor costs lower there, but also the main components can be purchased there up to 50% cheaper.
Since failure rates and reduced performance in Chinese components are now limited (and are probably getting smaller and smaller), this is quite economical for the manufacturers overall.

The drone shown with the 2 rotors with the small concealed rotor heads probably only exists as a "paper" so far.

My 12200 has been with me since yesterday - good, because a few days ago my last YGE "special" quit the service after many years. Btw. Like the 400 again in an idle test....."


~powercroco~

Oh thats tragic :cry:



And to be clear Dr Okon the 12200 $89.00 sequre will be the next piece of fine china that breaks on your bench. Common sense would have at least purchase the 14200 pro with 350 amperes of burst current and quality BEC for 103.00 dollars. It already has the more effective heatsink....

it is 293 grams!!!! :hot_face:


We also gone see how many good years of service you get with Xi'

Even though I know you are going to get the smoke anyway. Good luck and please get some electrical safety training for higher voltages. I have no idea what the equivalent is there to NFPA 70 here in the united states.



:fire:
Later
Hubert

[Clugh]

350 grams for the complete drive is what is stated. I guess that's why Dr Okon would not report it . So my drive according to the other tuners calculations does greater than 40W/g. So it doesn't lead US....


My current 328.1 gram better cooled XNOVA 3226 geared drive complete here with spinner and prop on the scale in fact increases the already better power to weight ratio even if I use the Clugh rewound pyro 600 with the maxon gearbox versus the xnova. The maxon gearbox power handling is just as good as the super chief. The Pyro is the lightest of all three motors.

Is this is why you are here but remain remotely silent about such things. You and your friends know 328 grams is pretty good if you weigh 350 grams and get thumbs up Ralph. I see your enigma, Thomas the tuner, reported the GM 17 X 26 on the 5:1 super chief can generate 360 km/h. That's interesting

As well as the fact that his scorpion powered drive is actually 39.6 W/g based of his own data and the Clugh pyro power drive is well over 43.04 W/g.. So ill be dammed if Thomas's or your HK 3226 powered super chief drives are lonely out front. They are in the rear view mirror in America because not only is the motor and Maxon gear box 32 grams lighter with everything mounted, the lighter the pyro its self is 20 grams lighter than the HK and it is more efficient and makes more power. I guess you have to be mad at Thomas for reporting the rainbow drive weight and performance.

[Clugh]

Hi Dr I did finally fing the weight of a HK 3226 on a superchief 5.1 from the other tuner that actually post his numbers with nothing to hide. Now the boys can surely can ger excited about my little power dwarf in a speedfire2 or similar hotliners or F3S speed planes After reading this data .

Have a read Squawkers and enjoy the photos.... :stuck_out_tongue_wi


"Hello Steve,
you can rejoice, the 3226 with the 5:1 Superchief has even set a new record.
I decided on the 5:1, because with the gearbox drive, the power comes more from the speed.
As a 10 poler, it rotates a maximum of 49000U on the YGE, which it does without complaint, which is then 9800U, I don't need more than that accelerated with the GM18x22.




I wound it with max. filling degree to 1160U/V and operate it on the modified Opto135 with 3x SLS 4s1800 2NOC.

The 350g drive turns the GM18x22 with 8800U at 9.9kW 43V 230A on the test bench, and even with 80% efficiency at 88% speed stiffness, all measured with Unilog2, according to the speed calculator at least 12kg thrust.
After 5x 3sec with a 20sec break, the gearbox has 50°, the motor 70° and the ESC 75, all without cooling air flow on the test bench.
But the ESC gets a heat sink that is screwed tightly to the top of the fuselage so that the motor cables do not drag on the bell.

So the 250g motor has an output of 40W/g and thus takes the lonely lead, it had already struck me very positively 8 years ago.
However, it is already waving the white flag, the synclostprotection in the YGE has already mentioned so that it reduces the PWM to 99%.
When the voltage drops and the load falls in the air, it quickly goes to 100%, so it's designed just right.
Amazing that the 2NOC cells last at 48° before heated 125C with 3.5V/cell for 1-2sec, after that the load so the current decreases by 40% anyway.

The gearbox still seems underchallenged, only the GM spinner is at its torque limit, the shaft flattening is counterproductive.
If Christian's feet fall asleep, I still have the GM17x26, which is rotated at 9200U and should allow climbing over 100m/s.
When the 2nd fuselage is there, everything will be installed, hope I can get in the fuselage with the engine cables, I'll get to just under 2kg so 5kW/kg.
Then it's time to wait for good weather again."
VG
Thomas (Schmiddi)

[Clugh]

Hi,

I though Id share this information from Germany not that I expect and American or anyone else to go compete there but that the props and restrictions on the class can probably be fulfilled by the 2807-08 drone motors. Check it out:

"here I post the regulations for the "Schnuppi-Klasse" retro pylon competition at the Flugsportverein Cormoran

Kirkel e.V. on September 27 and 28, 2025:

Models based on the models of the old electric runabouts from the 80s and 90s, which at that time
still flew with 7 NiCd cells (Schnuppi class), such as Race Cat, Race Rat, Munga, as well as other models
of that time will be admitted Models of the various. Manufacturers such as Graupner, Robbe, Simprop, Weber etc. and all various self-made also flying wings
(please specify the model type on the registration).
The competition management determines the starting order before the start of the competition. Flight groups with a maximum of
3 pilots will be formed.
Race over 10 laps (Schnuppi):
The winner is the one who has needed the shortest time for the ten laps in the flown rounds (addition of
all rounds, no strings). For each CUT flown, 10 seconds are added to the respective lap time
. At least three rounds should be flown; if the schedule and weather permit, even more.
3S Lipo batteries with up to a maximum capacity of 2,200 mAh are used; brushless motors can
also be used. However, the maximum engine speed is limited, it depends on the propeller pitch:
e.g.
propeller type diameter/pitch rpm
Carbon Speed 4.7 x 4.7 29,400
APC 4.75 x 4.75 29,100
APC 4.75 x 5.5 25,100
APC 5 x 5 27,600
Carbon Speed 5 x 5 27,600
APC 5,25 x 6,25 22,100
Carbon Speed 5,5 x 5,5 25,100
APC 6 x 5.5 25,100
APC 6 x 6 23,000
Carbon Speed 6 x 6 23,000
APC 6.5 x 5.5 25,100
APC 6.5 x 6 23,000
APC 6.5 x 6.5 21,200
APC 6.5 x 7 19,700
APC 7 x 6 23,000
APC 7 x 7 19,700
RPM measurement is carried out directly before the flight with a freshly charged battery after 5 seconds of full-throttle engine runtime."


~Best regards
Gerhard Schwarz
FSV Cormoran Kirkel e.V.~

So these motors should be able to do well with all these props.

[Clugh]

APD certainly does not have to pack anything up either. A CM 260 which your friend list as suitable for your application list as 16.4 kW is 378 grams Dr. The APD F200 is 18kW and it weighs 36 grams .I you are smart you can think about this; I could run 10 of them for 180kW and still weigh less than 1 CM 260.

In fact, its weighs more than APD's 34 kw drive.

Does this mean you also gave up on the sequre 12200 that is well over 150 grams and can only burst 260 ampere.?

I thought the sequre was enough for "FUN" ???

:woozy_face:

[Clugh]

S.H.E. is already industry proven as very efficient and powerdense in e traction Here is the 24N22P industry example. Open end coils with cascaded 6 phase inverters. The winding factors are higher than anything Pink.

[Clugh]

Pink ist für Mädchen Dr. Echte Männer würden Rot tragen und erkennen, dass so etwas dualen 3-Phasen x 2 oder semi-12-Phasen-Betrieb ermöglicht. Ein Wechselrichter für jeden Quadranten. Weg mit dem rosa Krokodil, es sei denn, der Motor ist jetzt komplett weiblich. 😁.Eine Flugkarte kann vier eigenständige Wechselrichter auf die gleiche Weise steuern. Es ist nicht die Schuld der Industrie, wenn man nicht weiß, wie man die heute verfügbaren Möglichkeiten nutzt. Ein genialer modularer Stack ist in wenigen Sekunden realisiert. Ich schätze, die Kaskadierung der Wechselrichter zur Eliminierung von Subharmonischen geht über Ihren Rahmen hinaus. Schlagen Sie es nach. Elektroingenieure kennen es als S.H.E.-Kommutierungstechnik. Eliminierung von Subharmonischen.

[Clugh]

EDIT!
Eine Antwort ist die Bandbreite nicht wert, Dr.

Sie sind nicht "sequre".....

The castle 200 and APD 200 are both capable of more than 16.4 kW Ralph.

[Clugh]

The SparkFun OpenLog Artemis is an open source data logger that comes preprogrammed to automatically log IMU, GPS, serial data, and various pressure, humidity, and distance sensors. All without writing a single line of code! OpenLog Artemis, or "OLA," automatically detects, configures, and logs Qwiic sensors. The OLA is specifically designed for users who just need to capture a lot of data to a CSV and get back to their larger project.

Included on every OpenLog Artemis is an IMU for built-in logging of triple-axis accelerometer, gyro, and magnetometer. Whereas the original 9DOF Razor used the old MPU-9250, the OpenLog Artemis uses the latest ICM-20948 from InvenSense capable of nearly 250Hz logging of all nine axes. Simply power up the OpenLog Artemis and all incoming serial data is automatically recorded to a log file with baud rates up to 500000bps ^[1], supported! The OLA also has four ADC channels available on the edge of the board. Voltages up to 2V can be logged with 14-bit precision up to 1900Hz for one channel and 1000Hz logging all four channels. Additionally, based on feedback from users we've added an on-board RTC so that all data can be time stamped.

The OpenLog Artemis is highly configurable over an easy to use serial interface. Simply plug in a USB-C cable and open a terminal at 115200bps. The logging output is automatically streamed to both the terminal and the microSD. Pressing any key will open the configuration menu.

The OpenLog Artemis automatically scans, detects, configures, and logs various Qwiic sensors plugged into the board (No soldering! No programming!). Currently, auto-detection is supported on the following Qwiic products:

• Any u-Blox GPS Modules (Lat/Long, Altitude, Velocity, SIV, Time, Date) such as:
  • ZED-F9P 1cm High Precision GPS
  • NEO-M8P-2 2.5cm High Precision GPS
  • SAM-M8Q 1.5m 72 Channel GPS
  • ZOE-M8Q 1.5m Compact GPS
  • NEO-M9N 1.5m GPS
  • MAX-M10S 1.5m Ultra-Low Power GPS
• MCP9600 Thermocouple Amplifier
• NAU7802 Load Cell Amplifier
• LPS25HB Barometric Pressure Sensor
• BME280 Humidity and Barometric Pressure Sensor
• MS5637 Barometric Pressure Sensor
• MS5837 Depth and Pressure Sensor
• SDP31 Differential Pressure Sensor
• MS8607 Pressure Humidity Temperature Sensor
• MPR0025PA MicroPressure Sensor
• TMP117 High Precision Temperature Sensor
• AHT20 Humidity and Temperature Sensor
• SHTC3 Humidity and Temperature Sensor
• CCS811 Air Quality Sensor
• SGP30 Air Quality Sensor
• SGP40 Air Quality (VOC Index) Sensor
• SCD30 CO₂ and Air Quality Sensor
• SN-GCJA5 Particle Sensor
• VEML6075 UV Sensor
• VCNL4040 Proximity Sensor
• VL53L1X LIDAR Distance Sensor
• ADS122C04 ADC PT100 Sensor
• Qwiic Mux allowing for the chaining of up to 64 unique buses!
• MAX30101 Pulse Oximeter and Heart Rate Sensor
• ISM330DHCX IMU
• MMC5983MA Magnetometer
• KX134 Accelerometer
• ADS1015 ADC
• LPS28DFW Barometer
• VEML7700 Ambient Light Sensor
• TMP102 Temperature Sensor
• More boards are being added all the time!

This OpenLog uses common microSD cards to record clear text, comma separated files. You probably already have a microSD card laying around but if you need any additional units see the related items below. The OpenLog Artemis supports microSD cards formatted as FAT32 as well as the older FAT16 formats up to 32GB. The OpenLog Artemis can use any size microSD card and, as of firmware version 1.11, supports exFAT cards in addition to FAT32.

Very low power logging is supported. OpenLog Artemis can be configured to take readings at 500 times a second, or as slow as 1 reading every 24 hours. You choose! When there is more than 2 seconds between readings OLA will automatically power down itself and the sensors on the bus resulting in a sleep current of approximately 18uA. This means a normal 2Ah battery will enable logging for more than 4,000 days! OpenLog Artemis has built-in LiPo charging set at 450mA/hr.

New features are constantly being added so we’ve released an easy to use firmware upgrade tool. No need to install Arduino or a bunch of libraries, simply open the Artemis Firmware Upload GUI, load the latest OLA firmware, and add features to OpenLog Artemis as they come out!

The OLA can be tailored to many different applications and we will be releasing custom versions of the firmware which can be found on our Documents tab above.

---

The SparkFun Qwiic connect system is an ecosystem of I²C sensors, actuators, shields and cables that make prototyping faster and less prone to error. All Qwiic-enabled boards use a common 1mm pitch, 4-pin JST connector. This reduces the amount of required PCB space, and polarized connections mean you can’t hook it up wrong.

[Clugh]

So I have a way to measure accurately up to 30 Nm of torque ordered and on the way now This and the optical tach will give use the mechanical. Its on the way. So in a few weeks you can send any motor including Dr Okons and can tell you what it truly does. I already have the amplifier to feed the logging system. You mount the motor with an x mount on axis with you prop and run it. It does not care about the rpm only how much torque is exerted to get the prop there. You track the real rpm with the tach. A QTI sensor will look directly at a piece of white tape or painted line on a black bell

HP = (Torque × RPM) / 5252

The world can disregard the Dresden master of fallacy. I cannot wait to examine the crocodile a little more closely. The time has finally come .

Thanks for your time and patience,
Hubert

[Clugh]

Dr Okon is just not on our level. I developed a system with an internal spray bar for the Neumotor outrunners 9 years ago. Who would still struggle in 2025?

I have projects I'm working on and motors to wind. Enjoy the stuffed flounder. The season was over in NC this year sept. 15th....:sob:

The paper as a reference was written in 2023.... I had the system working in 2016.... Docta....

Talk to y'all boys later,
Hubert

[Clugh]

Perspectives on Electric Machines with Cryogenic Cooling Fabrizio Marignetti *,† and Guido Rubino † Department of Engineering, University of Cassino and South Lazio, 03043 Cassino, Italy * Correspondence: marignetti@unicas.it; Tel.: +39-0776-299-3716 † These authors contributed equally to this work

The proprietary gas cartridge, I use is less than 100 grams, hit this in less than a 3 second duration. So you can easily meter it for a full run. You actually dont want it to get too cold because it can go much lower than -29C and then you should use thermally conductive potting that can resist cryogenic shock.

:snowflake::snowflake::snowflake::snowflake: